OG

[illmatic99]

Hollinger:https://theathletic.com/3379842/202...n-a-string-of-many?source=user-shared-article


Portland would surely need to cough up its seventh pick in the 2022 draft to get Anunoby, but executing the deal is tricky now that the trade exception is gone. The Raptors wouldn’t necessarily want much of what Portland could offer in return as a matching contract (such as fully guaranteeing Eric Bledsoe’s $19 million for next year); the Blazers also would likely be a taxpayer if they did a deal that way. Obviously, Hart could also go into this deal, but I presume the Blazers would like to keep him and line up Hart-Grant-Anunoby at the two-three-four spots.

The alternative is the pu pu platter, aggregating six different contracts to salary-match Anunoby’s and then adding the seventh pick as the cherry on top. This works more easily if Nassir Little is in the deal, but Little is FOD (Friends of Dame) from what I hear and thus more likely to be left out of such an arrangement.

If so, the sloptacular combo of Greg Brown, Justise Winslow, Keon Johnson, Didi Louzada, Trendon Watford and a signed-and-traded Elijah Hughes would make juuuust enough money to be legal tender in an Anunoby swap, provided the trade happened after the July moratorium. If the Raptors added two small contracts of their own (say, Svi Mykhailiuk and Armoni Brooks), they would create a $17 million trade exception.

 

[SharpeScooterShooter]

Hollinger:https://theathletic.com/3379842/202...n-a-string-of-many?source=user-shared-article


Portland would surely need to cough up its seventh pick in the 2022 draft to get Anunoby, but executing the deal is tricky now that the trade exception is gone. The Raptors wouldn’t necessarily want much of what Portland could offer in return as a matching contract (such as fully guaranteeing Eric Bledsoe’s $19 million for next year); the Blazers also would likely be a taxpayer if they did a deal that way. Obviously, Hart could also go into this deal, but I presume the Blazers would like to keep him and line up Hart-Grant-Anunoby at the two-three-four spots.

The alternative is the pu pu platter, aggregating six different contracts to salary-match Anunoby’s and then adding the seventh pick as the cherry on top. This works more easily if Nassir Little is in the deal, but Little is FOD (Friends of Dame) from what I hear and thus more likely to be left out of such an arrangement.

If so, the sloptacular combo of Greg Brown, Justise Winslow, Keon Johnson, Didi Louzada, Trendon Watford and a signed-and-traded Elijah Hughes would make juuuust enough money to be legal tender in an Anunoby swap, provided the trade happened after the July moratorium. If the Raptors added two small contracts of their own (say, Svi Mykhailiuk and Armoni Brooks), they would create a $17 million trade exception.

@Ed O please read. I do not think your assessment of value is accurate. To think its a fair trade for ebec and OG to be swapped is simply a bad take. Sorry. I am a homer as much as anyone but reality is reality.

 

[SlyPokerCat]

Hollinger:https://theathletic.com/3379842/202...n-a-string-of-many?source=user-shared-article


Portland would surely need to cough up its seventh pick in the 2022 draft to get Anunoby, but executing the deal is tricky now that the trade exception is gone. The Raptors wouldn’t necessarily want much of what Portland could offer in return as a matching contract (such as fully guaranteeing Eric Bledsoe’s $19 million for next year); the Blazers also would likely be a taxpayer if they did a deal that way. Obviously, Hart could also go into this deal, but I presume the Blazers would like to keep him and line up Hart-Grant-Anunoby at the two-three-four spots.

The alternative is the pu pu platter, aggregating six different contracts to salary-match Anunoby’s and then adding the seventh pick as the cherry on top. This works more easily if Nassir Little is in the deal, but Little is FOD (Friends of Dame) from what I hear and thus more likely to be left out of such an arrangement.

If so, the sloptacular combo of Greg Brown, Justise Winslow, Keon Johnson, Didi Louzada, Trendon Watford and a signed-and-traded Elijah Hughes would make juuuust enough money to be legal tender in an Anunoby swap, provided the trade happened after the July moratorium. If the Raptors added two small contracts of their own (say, Svi Mykhailiuk and Armoni Brooks), they would create a $17 million trade exception.

Say it ain't so. Winslow has become the apple of a lot of folks eye are here.

How do ya'll feel about Winslow and #7 for OG?

I wouldn't do it for #7 alone. But with the way some of you love Winslow, I can't see ya'll being a fan of that one.

 

[Hoopguru]

Tremendous defender....but is he the 2nd star that this team needs?

Isn't Anf the second star?

 

[TBpup]

Isn't Anf the second star?

Looked good as the primary ball handler in garbage games. How will that play out playing off Dame in games that mean something? We all hope for And to become a 'star', but that is still a ways off.

 

[SharpeScooterShooter]

Say it ain't so. Winslow has become the apple of a lot of folks eye are here.

How do ya'll feel about Winslow and #7 for OG?

I wouldn't do it for #7 alone. But with the way some of you love Winslow, I can't see ya'll being a fan of that one.

I would do that. But we have to get something out of the ebec too.

 

[Hoopguru]

Looked good as the primary ball handler in garbage games. How will that play out playing off Dame in games that mean something? We all hope for And to become a 'star', but that is still a ways off.

agree, and he will be paid like one too.

 

[Freshtown]

Since Haynes is the primary one reporting it, I wonder if this is just Dame trying to use the media to express his wishes?

i.e., the front office may not feel the same way.

 

[Phatguysrule]

It's really not rocket science. You "breaking it down" demonstrates you are a bit confused so let me try to help.

If a guy is worth $19m and you're paying him $19m, then you are just breaking even. A team filled with that guy isn't going to be making the playoffs, because you should be seeking players that are worth MORE than their contracted amount. This tends to be superstars and guys on their rookie deals.

That doesn't mean that every player that you have on your roster needs to be adding value over his contracted amount--there are loopholes with the soft cap that make it better to have a guy worth something, anything, if there's no opportunity cost (like if you're already over the cap).

The only time you should give up substantial assets to acquire a player is when there's a likelihood of him adding value over his contracted amount (and/or if you have a "use it or lose it" situation with cap space, etc.).

So... looking at Toronto-Portland. If we assume that OG is worth right at his contract level (taking into account his injury history, his potential for improvement, the size and length of his contract, etc.), then Portland should only give up anything to get him if there's no opportunity cost (meaning: getting him won't cut off any opportunities to do something else). Trading Bledsoe's expiring deal would make sense since Portland presumably will cut him rather than guarantee his deal, so it's a "use it or lose it" situation. Giving up a lottery pick is overpaying, especially since there would probably have to be other salary-matching involved to make the deal work and I don't think Portland has bad contracts to dump (and any dumping would make the deal less appealing to Toronto).

From Toronto's perspective: I said that I don't think sending Bledsoe, alone, would be enough for them. They can keep OG with nothing but opportunity cost (trading him for other value) as they can pay him what he's worth and cross their fingers that he improves. The case for accepting Bledsoe is that they could get out from under OG's contract (cutting Bledsoe with minimal cap hit) and use that money elsewhere... I don't know the Raptors' cap situation well enough to know if that would have any appeal or not.

If not? Then the trade shouldn't happen since our agreed-upon at-contract-value OG is not something the Blazers should give up significant assets to acquire.

The Blazers have to give up value for the RIGHT to pay him.

If Toronto isn't trying to get rid of him why would they let him go for less than equal value in return? And we'd have to question why would we be chasing after a guy if his own team doesn't want him?

That's why Olshey never made moves...

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Hollinger:https://theathletic.com/3379842/202...n-a-string-of-many?source=user-shared-article

Sounds like the fact that we traded for Grant shows that we're not getting Anunoby, because we needed our trade exception if we were going to get him.

FINE BY ME!

 

[illmatic99]

Move on.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Say it ain't so. Winslow has become the apple of a lot of folks eye are here.

How do ya'll feel about Winslow and #7 for OG?

I wouldn't do it for #7 alone. But with the way some of you love Winslow, I can't see ya'll being a fan of that one.

I like Winslow alot. But you do have to give up something to get something, and if it comes down to him or Little I would choose to keep Nas. OG will be 25 in a few weeks. He is a versatile forward being 230 lbs with a 7'2 wingspan and is a pretty good 3pt shooter. His health is my only concern. I would be fine keeping the pick and Winslow or trading them for OG.

 

[MickZagger]

View attachment 48059

Sounds like the fact that we traded for Grant shows that we're not getting Anunoby, because we needed our trade exception if we were going to get him.

FINE BY ME!

That sucks because I’d rather have OG than Grant

 

[B-Roy]

I'm fine if we move one of Nas/Hart as long as we get a future first or some additional compensation coming back.

Current roster (assuming Ant and Nurk are re-signed) already has 5 players that will play close to 30 minutes or more (Dame, Ant, Nurk, Grant, Hart), and 2 players that will play 20+ (Nas, Winslow). We're going to sign a center to play backup center minutes. That's already 8 rotation players. Most teams can only play 9-10 rotation guys at max, quality > quantity. Adding OG just takes away minutes from other guys, and I'd argue OG is better than any one of Nas/Hart/Winslow. I definitely want to punt the value of one of those guys to a future season though. We aren't in a position to be getting fleeced on trade value for no reason.

 

[Tince]

I would rather roll the dice and hope that we hit big on Sharpe, rather than go get a guy who is best case a solid starter.

I get that theory, but I don't agree with it. OG is 24, I wouldn't say his ceiling is locked at just being a solid starter.

I'm not risk adverse, I think Sharpe has more upside, but I think the probability he ends up better than OG isn't there. Obviously it's all a guess. I don't want to whiff on consecutive top 10 picks. The last top 10 pick we missed on hurt us badly the last 4 years.

 

[Natebishop3]

I get that theory, but I don't agree with it. OG is 24, I wouldn't say his ceiling is locked at just being a solid starter.

I'm not risk adverse, I think Sharpe has more upside, but I think the probability he ends up better than OG isn't there. Obviously it's all a guess. I don't want to whiff on consecutive top 10 picks. The last top 10 pick we missed on hurt us badly the last 4 years.

I don't think you can compare the ZCO pick and this one.

Firstly, we should have never traded into the top 10 in that draft. We were a playoff team and we needed veteran help. We didn't need a rookie project big man. The development timeline for a young guard and a young big are not usually the same, mostly because of the struggles with fouls and staying on the court. But also Collins couldn't stay healthy (which is also a common issue with bigs.) I really wanted Paul George but there are conflicting reports about how that went down. I'm not sure if KP would have dealt him to us even if we had the best offer.

But if you do want to compare this pick and that pick, I don't think Collins was BPA. If the goal was to go into the lottery and grab a potential star, there's no way Collins was it. He projected out as a solid defensive big who could hopefully spread the floor. Maybe a Paul Millsap type player. We're talking about going after a guy like Sharpe, who some scouts compare to Anthony Edwards. We're looking for a legitimate star player to pair with Dame or Ant.

 

[Freshtown]

Fwiw, OG turns 25 next month. Not that it’s a huge difference, but people referring to him as a young 24 year old are (I think) overvaluing his youth and potential. I think he is what he is at this point. He may get a little better, but he’ll never be a ball handler or creator or driver. He’s a very good 3 and D and not much else.

 

[Sheldon Shape]

I really like OG but 7 plus Nas or Hart is overpay. They've got time to find their SF of the future. That maybe Little, the pick or someone who becomes available on the market. I think we should wait and see how it works.

 

[glazeduck]

I haven't bothered to read all 10 pages of the thread, but I find it interesting that I haven't seen much, if any, mention of OG's situation in Toronto... The only reason he's on the block is because he's unhappy there and they have a plethora of options at his positions now. That's not a situation that's going to resolve itself IN Toronto.

So sure, we might have competition to get him, because he's a fairly complete 2-way wing, but his market value is trending downward. It's looking more and more like we're not going to pay an exorbitant amount for him, but of Masai keeps asking for too much, it stands to reason that he might be had reasonably cheaper later this summer...

 

[Tince]

I don't think you can compare the ZCO pick and this one.

Firstly, we should have never traded into the top 10 in that draft. We were a playoff team and we needed veteran help. We didn't need a rookie project big man. The development timeline for a young guard and a young big are not usually the same, mostly because of the struggles with fouls and staying on the court. But also Collins couldn't stay healthy (which is also a common issue with bigs.) I really wanted Paul George but there are conflicting reports about how that went down. I'm not sure if KP would have dealt him to us even if we had the best offer.

But if you do want to compare this pick and that pick, I don't think Collins was BPA. If the goal was to go into the lottery and grab a potential star, there's no way Collins was it. He projected out as a solid defensive big who could hopefully spread the floor. Maybe a Paul Millsap type player. We're talking about going after a guy like Sharpe, who some scouts compare to Anthony Edwards. We're looking for a legitimate star player to pair with Dame or Ant.

I'm comparing an example where we took the bigger swing instead of playing the odds.

IMO OG is playing the odds, Shapre is taking the swing.

I haven't watched enough of Shapre AAU tape to feel confident he's got good odds to be worth the risk. If we draft him, I'll hope he hits!

 

[Rastapopoulos]

That sucks because I’d rather have OG than Grant

Grant's a fuck of a lot cheaper. I'd rather have OG than Grant too, if that was the choice, but I'd rather have Grant and the assets Masai would chisel out of us than OG.

 

[Tince]

I think it should be noted that almost everyone covering Toronto thinks there is zero change Toronto would take #7 of Nas for OG. That should give you an idea of how they value him.

 

[Mediocre Man]

IF.....Portland ended up with Dame/Ant/OG/Grant.....someone like Duren to run around, rebound, switch out, block shots, and dunk everything in site, might not be bad.

Exceptional. Or Thybulle locking up oppo

 

[Natebishop3]

I'm comparing an example where we took the bigger swing instead of playing the odds.

IMO OG is playing the odds, Shapre is taking the swing.

I haven't watched enough of Shapre AAU tape to feel confident he's got good odds to be worth the risk. If we draft him, I'll hope he hits!

It's such a Neil Olshey move though. His "big swing" was for a project big man, who even admitted that he was more comfortable at center. This is literally just a few months after trading for Nurk, who was only 22 at the time, and had come in and done very well for us averaging 15 and 10 in his games with Portland after the trade.

Kinda reminds me of him drafting CJ the summer after Dame won ROY.

 

[craigehlo]

 

[SharpesTriumph]

That sucks because I’d rather have OG than Grant

I'd rather have Grant and the #7 than OG.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

I think it should be noted that almost everyone covering Toronto thinks there is zero change Toronto would take #7 of Nas for OG. That should give you an idea of how they value him.

Good for them. Let them keep OG on the bench behind two forwards they like more, on a middling playoff team and see how happy everyone is.

 

[TBpup]

Good for them. Let them keep OG on the bench behind two forwards they like more, on a middling playoff team and see how happy everyone is.

Sounds like they are open to moving Trent instead.

 

[1 Eye Jack]

I’m ok with whichever way they choose to go OG would be major upgrade and more sure thing than draft pick. If they decide to keep draft pick I’d love to see Daniels or Sharpe picked and I’d be ok if we trade down couple of spots pick up additional player and still have a draft pick.

only big concern I had/have was trading 7 for Grant or trading 7 plus Nas or Hart (which would be over paying IMO)

 

[CJ_is_Gone]

Here's a thought:

Portland - OKC
7 <-> 12 + 34 + Future 1 + Dort

Portland - Toronto
12 + Hart <-> OG

Portland - Charlotte
Bledsoe + Winslow + Didi <-> Hayward + 15

Portland picks at 15 + 34 & then also has:
Dame, OG, Hayward, Grant, Nurk as starters
& Ant, Little, & (xx FA) as key reserves off the bench.