OT: Jordan is the greatest ever to play the game

Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

Register Log in
magnifier661

magnifier661

B-A-N-A-N-A-S!
Joined
Oct 2, 2009
Messages
59,328
Likes
5,588
Points
113


[video=youtube;LAr6oAKieHk]

I just haven't seen anyone as impressive as this guy
 
Not sure who would bother arguing this. Seems pretty cut and dry.
 
Jordan dominated at a time when I think the league was at its very best. It would be interesting to see where the Bulls would have ranked when the Celts and Lakers were running things, but I still think Jordan would reign supreme.
 
I remembered some of the craziest plays were how him and Pippen would dunk off the free-throw misses by their team.
 
I'll be the guy who disagrees! He may be the most individually impressive, but if it weren't for a guy named Arvydas Sabonis people wouldn't be wearing Air Jordan's today. MJ owes Sabas the vast majority of his fortune.
 
He still would have been the greatest if the refs called everyone by the same rules, but the margin wouldn't have been anywhere near as wide between him and the next few guys...
 
blue9 said:
I'll be the guy who disagrees! He may be the most individually impressive, but if it weren't for a guy named Arvydas Sabonis people wouldn't be wearing Air Jordan's today. MJ owes Sabas the vast majority of his fortune.
Click to expand...


LMAO!!!!
 
I agree that Sabonis would have made a huge difference if he had come over. I don't think MJ would have gotten quite so many rings.
 
If LeBron keeps up what he has been doing this year over the next 4 years, I think he may have a case.

If LeBron truly wanted to be the next "MJ" I think he could easily average 30+ points a game. I think he really just wants to be the first "LeBron" and be more Oscar-like in his approach.

I think the Kobe to MJ comparisons are laughable. Kobe has never been the defender, passer or playmaker MJ ever was.
 
OregonHuskerMan said:
If LeBron keeps up what he has been doing this year over the next 4 years, I think he may have a case.

If LeBron truly wanted to be the next "MJ" I think he could easily average 30+ points a game. I think he really just wants to be the first "LeBron" and be more Oscar-like in his approach.

I think the Kobe to MJ comparisons are laughable. Kobe has never been the defender, passer or playmaker MJ ever was.
Click to expand...

Yeah I could see the case for Sabas and LBJ. LBJ is the closest thing to the sheer dominance of Jordan, IMO.
 
The thing is there is a lot of people that could be or may have been (with different circumstances) as good but no one that actually really was (or really is at this point).
 
blue9 you are an asshole for bringing up Sabas man!!!! I am wondering what this team would look like with the same Sabas we had 12 years ago.
 
OregonHuskerMan said:
If LeBron keeps up what he has been doing this year over the next 4 years, I think he may have a case.

If LeBron truly wanted to be the next "MJ" I think he could easily average 30+ points a game. I think he really just wants to be the first "LeBron" and be more Oscar-like in his approach.

I think the Kobe to MJ comparisons are laughable. Kobe has never been the defender, passer or playmaker MJ ever was.
Click to expand...

Lebron is just different. He's certainly great in his own way, but MJ's game combined with his demeanor was just so indomitable. I just don't see that same killer instinct in James and I doubt he'll ever be Jordan's competition for GOAT.
 
Nikolokolus said:
Lebron is just different. He's certainly great in his own way, but MJ's game combined with his demeanor was just so indomitable. I just don't see that same killer instinct in James and I doubt he'll ever be Jordan's competition for GOAT.
Click to expand...

That's it for me as well. Few players have the same kind of drive that Jordan had.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I agree that Sabonis would have made a huge difference if he had come over. I don't think MJ would have gotten quite so many rings.
Click to expand...
Precisely my point. MJ is only "the greatest ever" due to all the hardware. If he had only won one or two rings, the waters would be MUCH murkier. It certainly wouldn't be unanimous that he was "the greatest ever"...and he might not even be in the conversation with only 1 or 2 rings.
I understand that on the surface it seems laughable to question MJ's place in history, but it's largely due to circumstances. Of course it can never be proven that Jordan wouldn't have a double-threepeat if Sabas had come over. But I think a pretty strong argument can be made that PDX would have won a handful of championships if Sabas came over when (or shortly after) he was drafted. And that would make ALL the difference in the world with how MJ is viewed today. It's doubtful that he'd have all the ancillary endorsements that he STILL has.
So, I stand by my statement that MJ owes everything he has to Sabas.
(Oh, and just to be clear - I'm not making the case that Sabas is the greatest ever. I'd like to, but I'm not.)
 
blue9 said:
Precisely my point. MJ is only "the greatest ever" due to all the hardware. If he had only won one or two rings, the waters would be MUCH murkier. It certainly wouldn't be unanimous that he was "the greatest ever"...and he might not even be in the conversation with only 1 or 2 rings.
I understand that on the surface it seems laughable to question MJ's place in history, but it's largely due to circumstances. Of course it can never be proven that Jordan wouldn't have a double-threepeat if Sabas had come over. But I think a pretty strong argument can be made that PDX would have won a handful of championships if Sabas came over when (or shortly after) he was drafted. And that would make ALL the difference in the world with how MJ is viewed today. It's doubtful that he'd have all the ancillary endorsements that he STILL has.
So, I stand by my statement that MJ owes everything he has to Sabas.
(Oh, and just to be clear - I'm not making the case that Sabas is the greatest ever. I'd like to, but I'm not.)
Click to expand...

Did you know that Jordan has the highest career PER than any other player in NBA history? Did you know that he had a 30+ PER for 6 consecutive years, while defense was allowed to hold him from the perimeter?

I think too many people overlook just how good Jordan was. He was doing things in a talent filled league, with all teams and key players putting a "Bullseye" on his back. Tell me any player that was that good against that much competition?
 
Did you know I don't care about PER?
And for as much as it sounds like I'm denying MJ's greatness, I'm not. There's a reason he's universally accepted as the greatest to ever play the game. I just like to argue the point about the malleability of history. Whenever I hear talk about Jordan I can't help but think of how different history would likely be if Sabas came over earlier.
 
blue9 said:
Did you know I don't care about PER?
And for as much as it sounds like I'm denying MJ's greatness, I'm not. There's a reason he's universally accepted as the greatest to ever play the game. I just like to argue the point about the malleability of history. Whenever I hear talk about Jordan I can't help but think of how different history would likely be if Sabas came over earlier.
Click to expand...

It really doesn't matter if you like it or not. It's a definite sign of the efficiency of the player. Also, did you know that the PER differential was greater than any other player in the NBA? So you may not care about his PER, but his PER being so much greater than the other team's SG's PER is a huge achievement.

And quite honestly, we could say the same if Oden wasn't injured. Maybe Roy stayed healthy? Maybe if we had a better coach than Nate? Those are all hypotheticals that didn't happen so it can't be factored.

We can only give credit and rating to what "Has" happened. Jordan destroyed the Knicks, with Ewing being arguably the best defensive center of his generation. He also dismantled the Magic with a Shaq led team. He pummeled past the Cavs with the great Price, Daughtery and Nance.

The road through the East was extremely hard. Most those teams were physical and they would foul you hard. Today's players wouldn't be able to last 20 minutes in physical games like they had in the 90's.
 
Wilt is the only one I would put in MJ's category. LBJ will probably get there though.
 
I've always felt Wilt Chamberlain was just a bit better individually. He dominated his competition. Rules were changed to make it harder for him to dominate the game (goal-tending, 3 second in key, size of key expanded, etc.). The reverse is true for Jordan (hand checking).
 
blue9 said:
Precisely my point. MJ is only "the greatest ever" due to all the hardware. If he had only won one or two rings, the waters would be MUCH murkier. It certainly wouldn't be unanimous that he was "the greatest ever"...and he might not even be in the conversation with only 1 or 2 rings.
I understand that on the surface it seems laughable to question MJ's place in history, but it's largely due to circumstances. Of course it can never be proven that Jordan wouldn't have a double-threepeat if Sabas had come over. But I think a pretty strong argument can be made that PDX would have won a handful of championships if Sabas came over when (or shortly after) he was drafted. And that would make ALL the difference in the world with how MJ is viewed today. It's doubtful that he'd have all the ancillary endorsements that he STILL has.
So, I stand by my statement that MJ owes everything he has to Sabas.
(Oh, and just to be clear - I'm not making the case that Sabas is the greatest ever. I'd like to, but I'm not.)
Click to expand...

The problem with the "What If" game is that people always make the assumption what if X happened, but EVERYTHING else stayed the same, which is unfair, and likely inaccurate. It's assuming nobody ellse made moves to counter Sabonis comin gover, or that everything else remained virtually the same with Portland, but they just had a dominant C in the middle, without guessing how it miht have affected anything else. Who knows, maybe Chicago keeps Olden Polynice over Pippen! lol
 
I understand that. And admitted that you can never really know what would have happened. But in my world, the Blazers with the addition of Sabas would have been Champs regardless of any moves that other teams may have made. :D
 
I think Oscar Robertson and Wilt were better than MJ. That said, they were all very great players.
 
My reasoning for LBJ is this - virtually every night he is:

The best defender on the court. The best passer on the court. The smartest player on the court. The best scorer on the court (except against Melo, KD, Kobe) and you could start him at all 5 positions and have him guard the opposition, other than 2 or 3 centers. He is automatically a top 3 PG, a top 3 SG, the best SF OR PF, and probably a top 5 center. That is versatility that is irreplaceable.

He won't eat your heart and savor it like Jordan, but he will slowly and methodically beat your team down into a little pulp either through defense, scoring, passing or rebounding. The issue with Jordan is he would dominate purely by scoring...LBJ just isn't like that. I don't think it's fair to say that scoring makes you dominate, but passing, rebounding, defending make you a pushover.

LBJ isn't on Jordan's level yet, but he is close. And he is 28. And with his new found post game he is lengthening his career.
 
OregonHuskerMan said:
My reasoning for LBJ is this - virtually every night he is:

The best defender on the court. The best passer on the court. The smartest player on the court. The best scorer on the court (except against Melo, KD, Kobe) and you could start him at all 5 positions and have him guard the opposition, other than 2 or 3 centers. He is automatically a top 3 PG, a top 3 SG, the best SF OR PF, and probably a top 5 center. That is versatility that is irreplaceable.

He won't eat your heart and savor it like Jordan, but he will slowly and methodically beat your team down into a little pulp either through defense, scoring, passing or rebounding. The issue with Jordan is he would dominate purely by scoring...LBJ just isn't like that. I don't think it's fair to say that scoring makes you dominate, but passing, rebounding, defending make you a pushover.

LBJ isn't on Jordan's level yet, but he is close. And he is 28. And with his new found post game he is lengthening his career.
Click to expand...

I think James is the best player since MJ. At the end of his career he will probably be a top 5 of all time.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Idog1976
OT: Holy crap jordan
2 3
Replies
83
Views
5K
Natebishop3
Natebishop3
Wizard Mentor
Cure for the Lull: Damian Lillard Video
Replies
8
Views
432
Wizard Mentor
Wizard Mentor
Natebishop3
OT: Jordan in the HOF
2 3 4
Replies
103
Views
10K
Natebishop3
Natebishop3
KingSpeed
OT: Kobe vs Jordan?
5 6 7
Replies
197
Views
15K
jlprk
jlprk
Strenuus
OT: Could this happen at the Moda Center one day?
Replies
9
Views
591
Eastoff
Eastoff

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 1 (members: 0, guests: 1)
Back
Top