rockets forum...

[free_lafrentz]

To me it just seems that anyone guarding Yao in this league, at some point, will have to sell a few calls if they want to get him in foul trouble. Yao is just too big and strong to "not flop" against and keep your matchup competitive.

 

[bigbailes]

Guide to flopping:

If you like the player, or he's on your favourite team, he's "framing the foul."
If you don't like the player, or he's on the opposing team, he flopped.

i love joel but he did flop on yaos fourth foul

 

[sabas4mvp]

flopping is part of the game. It's like when a guard pump fakes and gets his defender in the air and then basically jumps into their body while throwing the ball at the hoop to go to the foul line. Roy used to never do that in his rookie year and it's like he realized all the superstars do it and that it would help his game, so he began doing it and now he does it almost once a game. I used to hate it when Kobe did that to us, but now that Roy does it, I don't care.

Yao is huge and hard to defend. If Joel has to "flop" to get a foul on Yao, do it. This is the palyoffs. If Yao flopped his way to the finals the rockets fans wold not give a shit.

 

[oldmangrouch]

No sound? So you don't hear Lamarcus Aldridge yelling "ahhhhhhhhhhh" everytime he shoots a fadeaway jumper? That's how he lets us know he was fouled!!

P.S. Does that ever work? Does an official ever hear a guy yell and say, "oh, I guess he WAS fouled - better blow my whistle"???

No, but I can recall at least 2 cases (one involving Clyde, the other Larry Johnson) where a seriously injured player got a "T" for crying out in pain as they were on the floor!

 

[Minstrel]

flopping is part of the game. It's like when a guard pump fakes and gets his defender in the air and then basically jumps into their body while throwing the ball at the hoop to go to the foul line.

Otherwise known as "the Reggie Miller."

 

[RR7]

I thought the Reggie Miller was more sticking out your leg as a defender runs by, adn getting the shooting foul? Or did he perfect both of those moves?

 

[The Professional Fan]

We saw it when Yao barely touched him to get Yao's 4th foul. We saw it on a no call when Aaron Brooks got position on Przy and Joel went down like he had been shot.

You can still be a Blazer fan and acknowledge Joel is a shameless flopper. Sadly, you have to sell calls in this league.

Can it really be considered a flop when a 7'6" 300lb Chinese Robot runs you down?

I think not.

 

[blue32]

Can it really be considered a flop when a 7'6" 300lb Chinese Robot runs you down?

I think not.

agreed;

he's a god damned nuclear genome science experiment that the chinese put together to dominate the olympics, and uSa's NBA.

him and Yi! except they fucked up with Yi and mixed a little bit of Dolly's gene's in there.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Wow, Rockets fans are a bunch of pissy little whiners. They simply can't accept defeat (let alone accept it with class, grace and dignity) and blame their own team's shortcomings on the other team and the refs. They basically hate anyone who beats them in the playoffs (did you read all the Utah hate in that thread - almost made me like the Jazz for bouncing them in the 1st round the last two years - almost). So, this is a good sign. I guess Portland will be the target of their future hatred after their team once again chokes in the 1st round.

They are also homophobic hypocrites. What's with all the trying to come up with "clever" signs about his "gayness".

And this from fans of a team that has two of the biggest floppers in the entire leaguer - Scola and Battier. They admire the craftiness of their players, but hate it when others do the same. Joel may have flopped on Yao's 4th foul in game 2, but that's ONE play. Scola flops around like a spineless ragdoll. It's the "best" part of his game. Joel actually steps in, plants his feet and takes a lot of legitimate charges. If Luis Scola is a "heady defender", Joel Przybilla is the Stephen Freakins Hawking of the paint.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

P.S. They only hate you if they fear you. Rockets fans are letting their own insecurity about their team's past failures show through in a big way.

BNM

 

[durvasa]

I think Joel flops more than the average player but I actually don't believe he flops that much. If you watch replays of when he does "flop" it's usually when he's completely set and someone barreled into him. Now the one w/ Yao in Game 2, that was an obvious flop. But I think Joel almost has to add some extra drama to his falls because otherwise no one would believe that a 7' player could be "charged".

I know he had at least one other extremely egregious flop against Yao earlier in the year. Might have been the second game they played in Houston.

I actually like Joel Pryzbilla a lot. I'd love him as a backup C on my team. But he has to be near the top of the list of worst post defense floppers. Varaejo is king, Oberto is pretty good, but Pryzbilla is right there as well. And, yes, Scola does flop. But he's Argentinian and has played in Europe, so he has an excuse.

What I was referring to (25 seconds in). And Scola comes back with a flop of his own ... though at least he wait for the contact before he started falling down. There is an art to flopping correctly!

[video=youtube;4_rvHz0GVro]

 

[Minstrel]

I thought the Reggie Miller was more sticking out your leg as a defender runs by, adn getting the shooting foul? Or did he perfect both of those moves?

He did both. He was the master of creating contact and flailing as though he was the one who got hit.

 

[RR7]

And as you see by the highlights, our flop is called a foul on Joel, and your flop was called a foul on LMA. So it's unfair officiating to your advantage.

 

[rocketeer]

Wow, Rockets fans are a bunch of pissy little whiners. They simply can't accept defeat (let alone accept it with class, grace and dignity) and blame their own team's shortcomings on the other team and the refs. They basically hate anyone who beats them in the playoffs (did you read all the Utah hate in that thread - almost made me like the Jazz for bouncing them in the 1st round the last two years - almost). So, this is a good sign. I guess Portland will be the target of their future hatred after their team once again chokes in the 1st round.

have you ever heard of anyone but jazz fans who liked the jazz? everyone hates the jazz.

And this from fans of a team that has two of the biggest floppers in the entire leaguer - Scola and Battier. They admire the craftiness of their players, but hate it when others do the same. Joel may have flopped on Yao's 4th foul in game 2, but that's ONE play. Scola flops around like a spineless ragdoll. It's the "best" part of his game. Joel actually steps in, plants his feet and takes a lot of legitimate charges. If Luis Scola is a "heady defender", Joel Przybilla is the Stephen Freakins Hawking of the paint.

scola is more of a flopper than joel. definitely. i don't agree with the general consensus that battier is a huge flopper though. he gets to spots and takes hits. he's a great positional defender. his reputation as a defender definitely gets him some calls he doesn't deserve where he wasn't quite in position or didn't get there fast enough, but his flopping is vastly overstated.

 

[durvasa]

hey, I don't know if your face has ever seen the light of day from it's normal habitat... true story! I do know that I linked the rules and you referenced some sort of innuendo of unwritten rules and a secret memo that you claimed dictated a series years back... sounds like an X-files episode.

whatever dude...

STOMP

You asked why I thought the refs spoke to the teams, and I provided two sources. The Referee Guide off NBA.com which indicates that a player who leaves his feet in the restricted area will not be called for a blocking foul when there's contact, and a report on refs speaking to teams before preseasons on various points of emphasis which backed up exactly what I said. You dismiss that as "innuendo"?

whatever due ...

 

[Natebishop3]

I know he had at least one other extremely egregious flop against Yao earlier in the year. Might have been the second game they played in Houston.

I actually like Joel Pryzbilla a lot. I'd love him as a backup C on my team. But he has to be near the top of the list of worst post defense floppers. Varaejo is king, Oberto is pretty good, but Pryzbilla is right there as well. And, yes, Scola does flop. But he's Argentinian and has played in Europe, so he has an excuse.

What I was referring to (25 seconds in). And Scola comes back with a flop of his own ... though at least he wait for the contact before he started falling down. There is an art to flopping correctly!

And like I said, Joel flops to illustrate a real foul. Yao lowered his shoulder in that play. Yeah, Joel flopped, but Yao created the contact. Scola flopped on an Aldridge backdown. At no time did Aldridge lower the shoulder. It was his butt the whole way.

 

[durvasa]

And as you see by the highlights, our flop is called a foul on Joel, and your flop was called a foul on LMA. So it's unfair officiating to your advantage.

They are both flops, in my view, but not of the same degree. So I wouldn't call that unfair officiating.

Joel flopped before the contact, and while on the ground his feet tripped up Yao. That has to be either a no call or a defensive foul. Scola appeared to flop after receiving the bump square in the chest. To me, on review, that's a no call, but it's really a judgment call because you have to be able to gauge in real time how much contact Scola really received. Those can, and routinely do, go either way.

 

[durvasa]

And like I said, Joel flops to illustrate a real foul. Yao lowered his shoulder in that play. Yeah, Joel flopped, but Yao created the contact. Scola flopped on an Aldridge backdown. At no time did Aldridge lower the shoulder. It was his butt the whole way.

Yao is just turning into the lane for his jump hook (he can't help it that he's 7'6), and to me it looks like Pryzbilla was falling down before there even any contact. Are my eyes playing tricks on me?

BTW, check 1:40 as well. Another flop!

And, geez, ... two more flops back to back at 7:35!

 

[Natebishop3]

Yao is just turning into the lane for his jump hook (he can't help it that he's 7'6), and to me it looks like Pryzbilla was falling down before there even any contact. Are my eyes playing tricks on me?

You don't see Yao turn and ram his whole upper body, shoulder first, into Joel?

On the Aldridge foul, technically it's a foul because you aren't supposed to be able to dislodge a defender, but he's just using his butt and back. It's the same as any post player backing someone down. Yao actually turned and lowered his shoulder into Przybilla.

 

[The Professional Fan]

Here's what's weird about Houston fans. At least from my perspective.

Their online fan community is obviously very passionate and crazy, which I think is a good thing. But every Rocket home game I watch on TV it seems like the arena is half full and seems really quiet. Maybe it's a misguided perception on my part, but that first game we played in Houston this year, that arena seemed pathetic and dead.

 

[RR7]

So you admit that they're both flops, but say it's not unfair officiating? If anything, to be fair, they could call a foul on Joel for touching him with his foot, and the LMA one should be a no-call. So it is unfair if both are obviously flops that it's basically a net 2 in the foul column for the Blazers.

 

[Minstrel]

Here's what's weird about Houston fans. At least from my perspective.

Their online fan community is obviously very passionate and crazy, which I think is a good thing. But every Rocket home game I watch on TV it seems like the arena is half full and seems really quiet. Maybe it's a misguided perception on my part, but that first game we played in Houston this year, that arena seemed pathetic and dead.

A great deal of the Houston fanbase online is Chinese. They clearly aren't going to be filling up Houston's stadium.

 

[Natebishop3]

A great deal of the Houston fanbase online is Chinese. They clearly aren't going to be filling up Houston's stadium.

They could.......... if they allowed virtual seating. Put little cameras and monitors in every seat with speakers. Don't even have to leave the comfort of your home.

 

[durvasa]

So you admit that they're both flops, but say it's not unfair officiating? If anything, to be fair, they could call a foul on Joel for touching him with his foot, and the LMA one should be a no-call. So it is unfair if both are obviously flops that it's basically a net 2 in the foul column for the Blazers.

No, and here's why. To me (others here obviously disagree), Pryzbilla did not take the contact square in the chest before he fell. He was falling as Yao was turning into him. With Scola, he probably flopped, but he did so after taking the bump. And as indicated in a link I posted earlier, the NBA has said that just because player flopped, that in itself does not negate any contact that may have proceeded it. So, Scola clearly embellished by falling down, but the officials still have to ref the bump that occurred and decide if it was an offensive foul or not. That becomes a judgment call.

 

[durvasa]

Here's what's weird about Houston fans. At least from my perspective.

Their online fan community is obviously very passionate and crazy, which I think is a good thing. But every Rocket home game I watch on TV it seems like the arena is half full and seems really quiet. Maybe it's a misguided perception on my part, but that first game we played in Houston this year, that arena seemed pathetic and dead.

The reason is become the entire lower bowl of Toyota Center is filled mostly by corporate season ticket holders. They're not really the die hard Rocket fans, and many of them actually hang out in the lounge outside for much of the game. It sucks, but that's how the Rockets owner wants to make his money.

 

[The Professional Fan]

A great deal of the Houston fanbase online is Chinese. They clearly aren't going to be filling up Houston's stadium.

Good point.

 

[STOMP]

You asked why I thought the refs spoke to the teams, and I provided two sources. The Referee Guide off NBA.com which indicates that a player who leaves his feet in the restricted area will not be called for a blocking foul when there's contact, and a report on refs speaking to teams before preseasons on various points of emphasis which backed up exactly what I said. You dismiss that as "innuendo"?

whatever due ...

a mod (of all posters) from another fanbase comes in and takes the low road insulting me out of the blue questioning whether "I even know what I'm seeing" earns an FU... now you're acting indignant?

as a guest especially, give respect=get respect. Unfortunately you failed... feel free to piss off

STOMP

 

[STOMP]

have you ever heard of anyone but jazz fans who liked the jazz? everyone hates the jazz.

their fans are currently chanting Lakers Suck!... maybe we've misjudged them?

STOMP

 

[RR7]

An enemy of my enemy is (very briefly) my friend?

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

Don't you agree that if Yao jumps straight up in the air with his hands raised, it is not a foul when Roy drives into him? I want to see all the fouls Yao supposedly got away. Some Blazer fans can surely put together a nice video compilation of it.

And there was one guy on that board (CF.net, right?) who criticized the crowd for their standing ovation. Everyone else thought he was crazy, and recognized it as a classy move.

Unless they changed the rules, if a defender jumps, even if holding arms straight up, and there's body contact, that technically is a foul. It's not always called, but it is called more often than not, and as far as I know, has always been considered a foul.

If the offensive player runs into the defensive player who is holding his arms straight up while not moving his feet, nor in the air, then there is no foul (or there is an offensive foul if too much contact).

So, yes, Yao did get away with some fouls. I saw a few times where Yao jumped as Roy was driving to the hoop.

I'm not arguing the whole "Which team did the refs favor?" debate. Cuz frankly, both teams got away with a lot, and the fact that Rockets fans are wetting themselves over it is ridiculous. The officiating was terrible both ways, each teams' fans only recall the things that the other team got away with.