Politics Super Tuesday

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Hoopguru said:
He would have had a better chance than Hillary too in 2016.
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True. He can win the blue collar votes in Pennslyvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin that Hillary could not
 
Guess the only hope for progressives now is AOC in 24? or 28?

I'll support Joe regardless because it matters to me that Supreme Court appointees are not all Trump stans and I need some semblance of competence in the WH.

But damn you, DNC for not supporting a candidate who could actually speak two consecutive sentences without stuttering. After the impeachment hearings in the House/Senate, there seemed to be some hope for the future of this party, but with how all this went down with Pete/Amy and now Bloomberg, I feel super dejected.
 
Chris Craig said:
I don't know what channels Bernie watched, but CNN was heavily in favor of Biden.
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CNN is one of the few news channels I can stream live so I was watching CNN last night...my goodness, Wolf Blitzer was not hiding his happiness at the results for Biden. I'm not a Sanders supporter, but it was still pretty "unbalanced."
 
PtldPlatypus said:
I've already resolved to vote minor party regardless. Fortunately, I know that the Oregon electoral votes are already predetermined, so I never have to worry about "throwing away my vote" since I already know it's worthless.
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Imagine the fun we'd have here if our votes actually mattered!

barfo
 
illmatic99 said:
Guess the only hope for progressives now is AOC in 24? or 28?
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She's barely even old enough to run in 24. Her 35th birthday will be less than a month before election day.
 
illmatic99 said:
Guess the only hope for progressives now is AOC in 24? or 28?

I'll support Joe regardless because it matters to me that Supreme Court appointees are not all Trump stans and I need some semblance of competence in the WH.

But damn you, DNC for not supporting a candidate who could actually speak two consecutive sentences without stuttering. After the impeachment hearings in the House/Senate, there seemed to be some hope for the future of this party, but with how all this went down with Pete/Amy and now Bloomberg, I feel super dejected.
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Create a third party. Bernie and AOC and such are barely democrats. They obviously have support Bernie doesn't even want to be part of the Democrat party, that's why he's always railing against the democrat establishment while also hanging on to the Democrat tag so he can pick up blue votes. They all appear to have this it's our way or the highway approach anyway so it's not like they're willing to concede anything to more moderate democrats. Bernie / AOC and those folks could actually create a decent third party for progressives and get support but they won't they'll just complain that the party they really don't want to be in because their views are way further left than most of the party, isn't doing what they want... This whole last two elections with Bernie have been so freaking weird. His voters basically hate the Democrat establishment, many of which won't for other democrats. The Democrats don't seem to want them either...
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
Create a third party. Bernie and AOC and such are barely democrats. They obviously have support Bernie doesn't even want to be part of the Democrat party, that's why he's always railing against the democrat establishment while also hanging on to the Democrat tag so he can pick up blue votes. They all appear to have this it's our way or the highway approach anyway so it's not like they're willing to concede anything to more moderate democrats. Bernie / AOC and those folks could actually create a decent third party for progressives and get support but they won't they'll just complain that the party they really don't want to be in because their views are way further left than most of the party, isn't doing what they want... This whole last two elections with Bernie have been so freaking weird. His voters basically hate the Democrat establishment, many of which won't for other democrats. The Democrats don't seem to want them either...
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This isn't the solution. We need unity, not more separation.

The really disappointing thing (more than the DNC meddling) is the youth turnout yesterday. WTF happened to the supposed engagement? It isn't enough to post memes on reddit--- get your asses to the voting booths.
 
Minstrel said:
A third party, if it actually got any support, would assure Republicans win every national election forevermore. I don't think Sanders or AOC want that.
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I disagree with you here. I think it would help the democrats. Many "republicans" especially the "moderate ones" I think would shift away from the extreme right and the democrats would basically be the moderate party. I think you'd see people flocking to the center. Many of the GOP are far right too.
 
illmatic99 said:
The really disappointing thing (more than the DNC meddling) is the youth turnout yesterday. WTF happened to the supposed engagement? It isn't enough to post memes on reddit--- get your asses to the voting booths.
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Is a revolution really worth having if you have to participate?

barfo
 
Minstrel said:
A third party, if it actually got any support, would assure Republicans win every national election forevermore. I don't think Sanders or AOC want that.
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TorturedBlazerFan said:
I disagree with you here. I think it would help the democrats. Many "republicans" especially the "moderate ones" I think would shift away from the extreme right and the democrats would basically be the moderate party. I think you'd see people flocking to the center. Many of the GOP are far right too.
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I actually think that @TorturedBlazerFan might be right here (not that he isn't often, I am just saying I think the same). There are a lot of people that voted for Trump last time because of their disdain for Hillary - there is a good chance they would stay away this time because there is a growing disdain for Trump as well, but if there was an alternate centrist option (in other words, the Democrats were not associated with the left leaning portion of Bernie, Warren, AOC etc.. - they might vote that.
 
illmatic99 said:
This isn't the solution. We need unity, not more separation.

The really disappointing thing (more than the DNC meddling) is the youth turnout yesterday. WTF happened to the supposed engagement? It isn't enough to post memes on reddit--- get your asses to the voting booths.
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Wait... Bernie didn't at all appeal to the unity crowd. His whole platform is you're going to do democratic socialism the way I want it to be done, or screw you basically. He seems to passionately dislike everyone right of him, and his supporters, for the most part, seem that way too. Not sure a vote for "Bernie" is a vote for Unity. In fact, the exit polls basically seemed to say that. Bernie voters were, we want wholesale changes, the "Biden" votes were mostly we want unity.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
I disagree with you here. I think it would help the democrats. Many "republicans" especially the "moderate ones" I think would shift away from the extreme right and the democrats would basically be the moderate party. I think you'd see people flocking to the center. Many of the GOP are far right too.
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Yeah, we'll have to agree to disagree. We'll see how Biden does, but I suspect he won't pull very many "cross-over Republican" votes. Cross-over votes were a thing a couple of generations ago, but have been vanishing over time. I don't think any current Republicans are looking for a moderate Democrat to support--I think any current disillusioned Republicans just dislike Trump's crassness and overt corruption. They're much more likely to either hold their nose and vote for the home team or else not vote. But Trump is a temporary problem for them.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
Wait... Bernie didn't at all appeal to the unity crowd. His whole platform is you're going to do democratic socialism the way I want it to be done, or screw you basically. He seems to passionately dislike everyone right of him, and his supporters, for the most part, seem that way too. Not sure a vote for "Bernie" is a vote for Unity. In fact, the exit polls basically seemed to say that. Bernie voters were, we want wholesale changes, the "Biden" votes were mostly we want unity.
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I'm not talking about Bernie's perspective, I'm talking about mine. I wanted radical change in DC, but I'm also not going to abstain from voting Trump out just because the policies Biden supports aren't as liberal. The key for me is still kicking this dumbass out of the WH.

Let's also not forget how quick Bernie was to endorse Hillary last time around. While some of his supporters are batshit crazy, a large majority of them (and he himself) are not.
 
Minstrel said:
Yeah, we'll have to agree to disagree. We'll see how Biden does, but I suspect he won't pull very many "cross-over Republican" votes. Cross-over votes were a thing a couple of generations ago, but have been vanishing over time. I don't think any current Republicans are looking for a moderate Democrat to support--I think any current disillusioned Republicans just dislike Trump's crassness and overt corruption. They're much more likely to either hold their nose and vote for the home team or else not vote. But Trump is a temporary problem for them.
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I think short term you might be right, because "democratic" party realignment would cause a lot of confusion and infighting, but long term like a couple election cycles people would look at the Far right which seems to be what the GOP is made up of when they get their next "Trump-esque guy" and if the "Progressive Party" took the extreme left from the democrats many of todays republicans would say ok I'll go to the one in the middle. Could be wrong, it's impossible to tell the future as of right now.
 
andalusian said:
I actually think that @TorturedBlazerFan might be right here (not that he isn't often, I am just saying I think the same). There are a lot of people that voted for Trump last time because of their disdain for Hillary - there is a good chance they would stay away this time because there is a growing disdain for Trump as well, but if there was an alternate centrist option (in other words, the Democrats were not associated with the left leaning portion of Bernie, Warren, AOC etc.. - they might vote that.
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Don't need a new party to do all this. For all the shit we heap on them, GOP is super united and always backs their candidate, regardless of how radical they are.
 
illmatic99 said:
I'm not talking about Bernie's perspective, I'm talking about mine. I wanted radical change in DC, but I'm also not going to abstain from voting Trump out just because the policies Biden supports aren't as liberal. The key for me is still kicking this dumbass out of the WH.

Let's also not forget how quick Bernie was to endorse Hillary last time around. While some of his supporters are batshit crazy, a large majority of them (and he himself) are not.
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Fair enough.
 
illmatic99 said:
Don't need a new party to do all this. For all the shit we heap on them, GOP is super united and always backs their candidate, regardless of how radical they are.
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I am saying that if there is a centrist party - some of the republican voters might consider voting for it when the GOP candidate is as distasteful as Trump is.
 
illmatic99 said:
Doesn't need a new party to do all this. For all the shit we heap on them, GOP is super united and always backs their candidate, regardless of how radical they are.
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I think there is a fair amount of we picked our team and were loyal to our team with the GOP / Conservative crowd. I'm not sure we see that as much with the left but still quite a bit. I'm not sure what's better having a Democratic party that is clearly divided amongst the "progressives" and moderates that seem to dislike each other to the point they don't want to show up if the other side is getting their way. Or two parties, but IMO a third Party gives options and voice to ideas and helps conversations.
 
illmatic99 said:
Don't need a new party to do all this. For all the shit we heap on them, GOP is super united and always backs their candidate, regardless of how radical they are.
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Also, a third party may not get elected as president but a viable third party or progressive party with a lot of support could affect local governments and bring about changes from the ground up instead of from the top.
 
The democrats are making the exact same mistake that they made four years ago.

It's eerily similar to when they put up John Kerry. You can't run a milquetoast candidate against someone charismatic. They thought they could beat Bush in 2004 because everyone hated him, and yet...... they didn't. The Republicans made this mistake as well when they put up Romney against Obama.

Biden won't win, and it sucks because I don't like Trump at all. Not really a fan of Sanders or Warren either though. There aren't any good politicians anymore.
 
Natebishop3 said:
The democrats are making the exact same mistake that they made four years ago.

It's eerily similar to when they put up John Kerry. You can't run a milquetoast candidate against someone charismatic. They thought they could beat Bush in 2004 because everyone hated him, and yet...... they didn't. The Republicans made this mistake as well when they put up Romney against Obama.

Biden won't win, and it sucks because I don't like Trump at all. Not really a fan of Sanders or Warren either though. There aren't any good politicians anymore.
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I disagreed with Obama quite a bit, but I think he was a good politician. I actually personality-wise really liked him. Which personality is pretty important as a politician.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
I think there is a fair amount of we picked our team and were loyal to our team with the GOP / Conservative crowd. I'm not sure we see that as much with the left but still quite a bit. I'm not sure what's better having a Democratic party that is clearly divided amongst the "progressives" and moderates that seem to dislike each other to the point they don't want to show up if the other side is getting their way. Or two parties, but IMO a third Party gives options and voice to ideas and helps conversations.
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I also think there is a divide among GOP voters between fiscal conservatives and religious conservatives - so I really do not think that the GOP is as united as people claim.
 
Natebishop3 said:
The democrats are making the exact same mistake that they made four years ago.

It's eerily similar to when they put up John Kerry. You can't run a milquetoast candidate against someone charismatic. They thought they could beat Bush in 2004 because everyone hated him, and yet...... they didn't. The Republicans made this mistake as well when they put up Romney against Obama.

Biden won't win, and it sucks because I don't like Trump at all. Not really a fan of Sanders or Warren either though. There aren't any good politicians anymore.
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Hold on, you think Trump is charismatic? There are some very good politicians out there. Bernie is terrific, save for his label of socialist which I wish he hadn't so explicitly embraced. A ton of the House members on the impeachment trials were awesome. Eric Swalwell and Patrick Maloney were really good. Schiff was too. And I think Cory Booker dropped out too quickly. There are potential candidates to save this party, but they clearly didn't have the resources or internal support to pursue the presidency.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
I disagreed with Obama quite a bit, but I think he was a good politician. I actually personality-wise really liked him. Which personality is pretty important as a politician.
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I agree that I really liked Obama as a person. Truly a classy guy and a classy family. Very likeable.

With that said, I didn't care for him much as a leader and I thought a lot (or most) of his decisions were poor ones.
 
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