Tanking

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HailBlazers said:
Something needs to be done.
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Honestly I'll stand by my idea that you give the best odds in the lotto to the best records outside of the playoffs to the worst records. I don't care if the lotto is for the top 4 picks, the top 3 or even the top 2.

You just make sure that the worst teams in the league have very little chance of landing the top guy or two or three. Then so bad teams have a chance to get better it goes worst record to best for the rest of the draft.

We would probably never see a sub 30 win season again. We would definitely never see blatant tanking again... people can say that teams would tank to get that top spot in the lotto (last spot out of the playoffs) but I just don't see that coming close to hurting the NBA product the way the current incentive to lose the most games possible all season does.
 
blazerkor said:
Honestly I'll stand by my idea that you give the best odds in the lotto to the best records outside of the playoffs to the worst records. I don't care if the lotto is for the top 4 picks, the top 3 or even the top 2.

You just make sure that the worst teams in the league have very little chance of landing the top guy or two or three. Then so bad teams have a chance to get better it goes worst record to best for the rest of the draft.

We would probably never see a sub 30 win season again. We would definitely never see blatant tanking again... people can say that teams would tank to get that top spot in the lotto (last spot out of the playoffs) but I just don't see that coming close to hurting the NBA product the way the current incentive to lose the most games possible all season does.
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That wouldn’t work either. The tanking would happen in the middle. The 7th & 8th place teams would tank to get into that 9th spot because a chance at Flagg is better than first round date with OKC,
 
KingSpeed said:
That wouldn’t work either. The tanking would happen in the middle. The 7th & 8th place teams would tank to get into that 9th spot because a chance at Flagg is better than first round date with OKC,
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It would only happen at the very very end of the season and that doesn't kill competition like the current system does. There might be teams competing to get out of the play-in but I think more teams would be competing to get up to that level. Right now we have around 10 teams tanking. How many teams would tank to get out of the playoffs and into the lotto??? Especially if it's just the top two picks.

You're telling me that a team would miss the playoffs on purpose to get a coinflip chance at moving into the top two with the alternative being that they end up with the 14th pick an no playoffs???
 
blazerkor said:
It would only happen at the very very end of the season and that doesn't kill competition like the current system does. There might be teams competing to get out of the play-in but I think more teams would be competing to get up to that level. Right now we have around 10 teams tanking. How many teams would tank to get out of the playoffs and into the lotto??? Especially if it's just the top two picks.

You're telling me that a team would miss the playoffs on purpose to get a coinflip chance at moving into the top two with the alternative being that they end up with the 14th pick an no playoffs???
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I liked the one I heard about where the odds are determined based on how many wins you have against teams with a better record than you. Every game would be insanely competitive with that system. If you’re the worse team, you want that upset win. If you’re the better team, you don’t want that team to get an upset win.
 
The solution is, reverse the order of assigning odds. 16 playoff teams not in lottery.

14 lottery teams:
best record, best odds of getting 1st pick
2nd best record, 2nd best odds of getting 1st pick
•
•
2nd worst record, 2nd worse odds of getting 1st pick
worst record, worst odds of getting 1st pick

Tank at your own peril
 
inconceivable said:
The solution is, reverse the order of assigning odds. 16 playoff teams not in lottery.

14 lottery teams:
best record, best odds of getting 1st pick
2nd best record, 2nd best odds of getting 1st pick
•
•
2nd worst record, 2nd worse odds of getting 1st pick
worst record, worst odds of getting 1st pick

Tank at your own peril
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Yeah this is what I've been saying and it should be about as heavily weighted as it is now but it doesn't need to be for the first four picks. In fact I'd only make it for the first two picks. That still leaves the team with the worst record in the league as the least likely team to land the 1st or 2nd pick but it does give them the 3rd pick which would hopefully help them get out of that spot as the worst team.

Also if we left it weighted about the same just for the first two picks, the best team to miss the playoffs would still only have around a 25% chance of moving up and I don't think a one in four chance of moving up would be worth tanking out of the playoffs.
 
I’ve always thought the best way to fix the lottery would either be to

A. Flatten the odds so the bottom 8? get the same odds. Then let playoff teams all draft from worst to best to start the second round

B. Give the play in teams the same odds for the top pick as the bottom teams
 
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It is amazing how close the 8-11 draft positions are right now.

upload_2025-3-17_7-26-0.png
 
You have to punish teams getting the top picks somehow. Punish the gms. Mandatory firing
 
You know what I find funny and sad is I see people complain that the Raptors just kind of gave up and STILL almost beat this team BTW just for you silly people who want them in the play in. My point is the last 2 or 3 seasons the Blazers were the fucking KINGS of tanking by not playing Dame when he could have played in his last season. When the Blazers just DNP'ed players like it was cool with "fake" / questionable injuries but now people like Nate and I was watching the post game show last night and those three clowns were talking about it too and acting all WTF.

If you want to be taken serious then stop acting all dejected and offended when a team does a better job of tanking then the Blazers maybe you should be upset at Billups and Sleepy Joe instead but you do you -- Cry baby mode
 
Is there any correlation between tanking and the seemingly softening of the NBA? Players resting more, flopping more, etc? Is it all part of a larger issue with regards to behavior and style of play? There doesn't seem to be the drive to win now. If you aren't leading the pack, you should be at the bottom, seems to be the mentality in everything and I disagree. I think persevering through mediocrity and working harder than the person next to you to win that a starting spot, to jump ahead in the standings, to earn that raise, is a lost ethic.
It seems the sense of entitlement is larger than ever before and I think the results are those not on the top, feel they cant compete at all and just give up instead of digging in.

Jordan couldn't get passed the Pistons, but they didnt tank. They hit the gym. they worker harder than any other team. Yes they made a great trade to get Pippen on draft night, but it wasn't a top pick they traded. They simply worked thier asses off.
 
This team was so close to being done with tanking but they pulled out too soon.

It’s like we started antibiotics and 75% of the way through the pills we decided we feel better so we stopped taking the meds but now there’s a good chance that the illness comes back. I’m this case the illness is being a mediocre team.
 
My idea to resolve tanking would be to reduce lottery percentages for teams that have both A.) won the #1 pick within the last five years and B.) have gotten a Top 5 pick at least 3 times in the last decade. Just a few percentage points. And you can stack up those two conditions together to deter more lottery wins by losing teams.

Then, you redistribute ping pong balls to the #7-14 standings with the higher numbers getting more. Suddenly, it's possible the #12-14 teams would resemble #9-11 odds while #9-11 teams would resemble #6-8 under the best circumstances.
 
Unfortunately I think tanking is a necessary evil for non-destination teams.

I think anything you do to limit tanking will just help destination teams win more titles.
 
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SharpeScooterShooter said:
Is there any correlation between tanking and the seemingly softening of the NBA? Players resting more, flopping more, etc? Is it all part of a larger issue with regards to behavior and style of play? There doesn't seem to be the drive to win now. If you aren't leading the pack, you should be at the bottom, seems to be the mentality in everything and I disagree. I think persevering through mediocrity and working harder than the person next to you to win that a starting spot, to jump ahead in the standings, to earn that raise, is a lost ethic.
It seems the sense of entitlement is larger than ever before and I think the results are those not on the top, feel they cant compete at all and just give up instead of digging in.

Jordan couldn't get passed the Pistons, but they didnt tank. They hit the gym. they worker harder than any other team. Yes they made a great trade to get Pippen on draft night, but it wasn't a top pick they traded. They simply worked thier asses off.
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Bulls already had Pippen when they played the Pistons in the playoffs.
 
SharpeScooterShooter said:
Is there any correlation between tanking and the seemingly softening of the NBA? Players resting more, flopping more, etc? Is it all part of a larger issue with regards to behavior and style of play? There doesn't seem to be the drive to win now. If you aren't leading the pack, you should be at the bottom, seems to be the mentality in everything and I disagree. I think persevering through mediocrity and working harder than the person next to you to win that a starting spot, to jump ahead in the standings, to earn that raise, is a lost ethic.
It seems the sense of entitlement is larger than ever before and I think the results are those not on the top, feel they cant compete at all and just give up instead of digging in.

Jordan couldn't get passed the Pistons, but they didnt tank. They hit the gym. they worker harder than any other team. Yes they made a great trade to get Pippen on draft night, but it wasn't a top pick they traded. They simply worked thier asses off.
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They had the best player in NBA history. And they drafted him #3.

They would have won exactly zero championships if they hadn't drafted MJ. If we had a player like MJ on this team (with an even decent coach) we'd probably be playing for home court advantage right now.
 
SharpeScooterShooter said:
Is there any correlation between tanking and the seemingly softening of the NBA? Players resting more, flopping more, etc? Is it all part of a larger issue with regards to behavior and style of play? There doesn't seem to be the drive to win now.
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They make 50x more money than they did in 1990, and know their value as licensing and marketing entities. It’s just business.
 
Phatguysrule said:
They had the best player in NBA history. And they drafted him #3.

They would have won exactly zero championships if they hadn't drafted MJ. If we had a player like MJ on this team (with an even decent coach) we'd probably be playing for home court advantage right now.
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That is irrelevant to my point. Even with the best player ever they couldn't win without putting in hard work in the offseason. Where he was drafted is irrelevant in the context of my post.
But to cater to your point, i do not believe the bulls tanked to get Jordan.
 
Everything Beagle said:
They make 50x more money than they did in 1990, and know their value as licensing and marketing entities. It’s just business.
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yeah. Tons of money now. So much so that i don't see how the bottom falls out once sponsorship funds fade.
Which i beleive is only a matter of time.
 
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