The Official S2 NBA Lockout Thread! (5 Viewers)

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KingSpeed said:
Okay, that seriously breaks my heart. PM me one thing each of them wants from Santa and I'll make sure Santa gets it for them. Anyone want to join in?
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sure, can I PM you and you can get me gifts too?
 
A fifty item Christmas list? This might be the year you let them know how little those items compare to having two parents that care. I would have no problem loaning you money till the lockout ends for a smaller list.
 
KingSpeed said:
Okay, that seriously breaks my heart. PM me one thing each of them wants from Santa and I'll make sure Santa gets it for them. Anyone want to join in?
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No way! You are a good man to offer, but no thank you. That wasn't my intent of that post. Thanks Eric.
 
Great tweets from Ken Berger

KBergCBS Ken Berger
Boies believes he's caught Stern in a gotchya moment when Stern said last Thursday, "The negotiations have ended." I recall that exchange.

KBergCBS Ken Berger
Right after Stern said that, Silver jumped in and said, "The negotiations on this proposal have ended." Could be important distinction.


Very astute pick up on Berger's part. At least I think it is
 
If any of you guys want to send me Christmas presents I'm not too proud to accept.
 
I've got about $150 I won't be paying for NBALP that I wouldn't mind seeing some of it go to HCP's kids.
 
1st paychecks missed: D. Howard ($745,224), Amare ($759,070), Arenas ($802,887) & Garnett ($887,499).
 
yuyuza1 said:
Similar sentiment from Bill Simmons (listen to his podcast on ESPN.com) who has repeatedly called this situation one of the biggest mishandlings in sports history.
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It's so hard to understand what the hell Simmons viewpoint is. He says Stern should be fired for his colossal failures these last few months. Then he says the NHL is far better from the lockout and a great sport as a result of all their changes. Then Simmons says the NBA would be far better if they made similar changes from a lockout. Then he says the NBA will never recover from a lost season. Simmons contradicts himself nonstop in the same damn podcast.
 
Draco said:
It's so hard to understand what the hell Simmons viewpoint is. He says Stern should be fired for his colossal failures these last few months. Then he says the NHL is far better from the lockout and a great sport as a result of all their changes. Then Simmons says the NBA would be far better if they made similar changes from a lockout. Then he says the NBA will never recover from a lost season. Simmons contradicts himself nonstop in the same damn podcast.
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seems like all the world is becomimg politicians, IMO the owners offer was "fair" and in the best interets of the game long term. However IMO the owners are bastards as well (just like the players) and when arrogance like this butt heads this is what happens. Perhaps it will take a season of losing a lot of money by all parties to get things bacl to some semblance of common sense. I agree the NHL is a good model and fun to watch, as is the NFL. Sometimes you just have to tear it down and start over again.
 
HCP said:
Boies aso says Northern District of Calif. has a history of moving cases quickly.
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Also, people in the Bay Area love "The Man" that owns the companies and hate the "little person" represented by unions.

It's called court-shopping.
 
HCP said:
Boies said a second separate lawsuit is being filed on behalf of three NBA players in Minnesota.
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Grounds for lawsuit: "Minnesota already had a full compliment of point guards and Kahn kept drafting more, costing us minutes."

Signed,
Luke Ridnour, Sebastian Telfair and Ricky Rubio
 
maxiep said:
Grounds for lawsuit: "Minnesota already had a full compliment of point guards and Kahn kept drafting more, costing us minutes."

Signed,
Luke Ridnour, Sebastian Telfair and Ricky Rubio
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Heya Max, was hoping that you'd drop in with you legalish slant on things. How do you think this will end? do you this the owners ultimately prevail in the courts and we miss the season and they get an NHL style settlement in the end?
 
Blazinaway said:
Heya Max, was hoping that you'd drop in with you legalish slant on things. How do you think this will end? do you this the owners ultimately prevail in the courts and we miss the season and they get an NHL style settlement in the end?
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I'm not a lawyer, I'm just constantly being sued (a career hazard of working in real estate investment).

My best guess is that we'll lose the season, the players will cannibalize themselves, the owners' future offers will be even worse than the 47% threatened, the new deal will be settled right before training camp and the cost structure of the league will be dramatically altered.
 
Draco said:
It's so hard to understand what the hell Simmons viewpoint is. He says Stern should be fired for his colossal failures these last few months. Then he says the NHL is far better from the lockout and a great sport as a result of all their changes. Then Simmons says the NBA would be far better if they made similar changes from a lockout. Then he says the NBA will never recover from a lost season. Simmons contradicts himself nonstop in the same damn podcast.
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It's good to know that Simmons is just as ridiculous as he was a couple of years ago when I stopped reading and listening to him :)

Ed O.
 
Players vs NBA class-action antitrust lawsuit filed in Oakland set for court on Feb. 29, 2012. Court official says date could be moved up.
 
HCP said:
Players vs NBA class-action antitrust lawsuit filed in Oakland set for court on Feb. 29, 2012. Court official says date could be moved up.
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lol at Feb. 29, they better hope it gets moved up. I think owners are now content to respond when necessary (legally) and sit back and watch the players miss checks and squirm.
 
Say the players win their lawsuit. Do you think they are going to be as generous with future salaries or with the next bargaining agreement?

I think that Stern is playing this the right way, but it is a shame that he does not have the negotiating skills to make the players want to take a deal he presents.
 
HCP said:
Players vs NBA class-action antitrust lawsuit filed in Oakland set for court on Feb. 29, 2012. Court official says date could be moved up.
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The best part is they picked Northern California because they tend to move quickly
 
Charcoal Filtered said:
Say the players win their lawsuit. Do you think they are going to be as generous with future salaries or with the next bargaining agreement?

I think that Stern is playing this the right way, but it is a shame that he does not have the negotiating skills to make the players want to take a deal he presents.
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I completely agree with this sentiment. If the NBA loses this suit, the players may come back to even worse pay and benefits than they could have had on Monday with a vote. The NFL, both players and owners, always had a zillion dollar national TV contract to pay the bills. The NBA doesn't have anything close to that, and is much more dependent on local revenues, via advertising, ticket sales, and local TV contracts.
 
NBA owners to discuss lockout plans

By Adrian Wojnarowski, Yahoo! Sports

After lawyers for NBA players filed antitrust suits against the league in California and Minnesota, commissioner David Stern has a conference call set with owners on Thursday to discuss their next steps in the lockout, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

The NBA’s labor relations committee, responsible for negotiations with the players, scheduled the call earlier in the week, sources said.

Shortly after the Players Association declared on Monday that it would disband as a union and file suit, Stern suggested in a TV interview the NBA wouldn’t be in a rush to initiate contact with the players’ attorneys.

For several reasons, it won’t be easy to get the owners to move quickly toward re-engaging the new leadership of the players. Many owners believed Stern had gone too far with the league’s final proposal to the union and were privately wishing for the players to reject the offer so they could thrust upon the players a far more rigid “reset” deal.

Also, Stern and many owners have such a visceral and personal disdain for players attorney Jeffrey Kessler, whom they blame for the breakdown in talks and eventual move toward the “disclaimer of interest” filing. Kessler drew the ire of Stern and the owners for saying the owners were treating the players like “plantations workers” in an interview with The Washington Post – a comment for which Kessler later apologized. Stern responded by saying Kessler “has been the single most divisive force in our negotiations,” and by calling Kessler’s conduct “routinely despicable.”

It seems unlikely Stern and the owners will want to be viewed as being in such fear of the legal battle that they’re rushing back to swiftly cut a less favorable deal with the players.

Carmelo Anthony(notes), Kevin Durant(notes), Chauncey Billups(notes), Kawhi Leonard(notes) and Leon Powe(notes) were listed as plaintiffs in the suit filed in Oakland, Calif. The initial case management conference for the suit is scheduled for Feb. 29, 2112, but can be moved up, court officials said.

Caron Butler(notes), Anthony Tolliver(notes), Ben Gordon(notes) and Derrick Williams(notes) are listed as plaintiffs in a second suit filed against the league in Minneapolis. The players are seeking “treble” damages in the suits, triple the $2 billion they could have made with a full season.

Boies said the suits were filed as a result of the owners “overplaying their hand” in negotiations with the players.

“You don’t give up hundreds of millions of dollars unless you want to make a deal and that’s what the players were doing,” Boies said. “I think it was mistake to push it as far as [the owners] did.”
 
HCP - I find it telling that the owners waited 3 days before even caring to put together a conference call to discuss, as a group, the rejected proposal. I'm going to guess that the Dolans and Busses, who had the clout to go to 50/50, are going to be much more united now with their small-market counterparts.
 
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