Toronto Raptors Dame trade ideas and rumors

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BankTeller said:
Why is everyone so ready to believe those reports about him requesting another trade to Miami, knowing Dame would be destroying his entire brand if he did that?
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I think so because of Goodwin's track record and continued use of Shams et al to disseminate his viewpoint. Haynes also has repeatedly said Miami only and you know that's coming from Dame directly.

Do you think that stuff is coming from Miami? I suppose that's a possibility considering their vested interest.
 
illmatic99 said:
I think so because of Goodwin's track record and continued use of Shams et al to disseminate his viewpoint. Haynes also has repeatedly said Miami only and you know that's coming from Dame directly.

Do you think that stuff is coming from Miami? I suppose that's a possibility considering their vested interest.
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This is only possible if Dame believes he already destroyed his reputation and that doing another heinous act won't affect him any more
 
BankTeller said:
Why is everyone so ready to believe those reports about him requesting another trade to Miami, knowing Dame would be destroying his entire brand if he did that?
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Because it's basically his personal mouthpieces saying it. His guy Haynes, and the agent's mouthpiece Shams.

No one else is coming out and saying that unless they are just repeating what those two said.
 
If he is as much of a badass as all his rapping says, he would go anywhere.
 
I do not want OG Anunoby as the focal point of a Dame trade. Dude either walks for nothing or we end up overpaying him and could be paying a starless forward duo a combined $70M a year.

If we plan on flipping him, it would need to be now, as I don't see him having more value mid-season with free agency coming up. He also wants more offensive responsibility and spending a season trying to please him in order to convince him to re-sign might get in the way of focusing on the development of Scoot, Sharpe, and Simons which is the most important thing this year.

I'd rather have Miami picks, have a better chance at having a top pick next year (because we're worse) and adding a future star to the Portland core on a rookie salary. Trade Jerami for whatever assets we can get. That'd open up cap space in the future which could be used to accumulate assets like rebuilding teams do. And then hopefully Miami can't recover from having no young core or picks to replace Lillard and Butler once they retire or decline. Having control of Miami picks from 2027-2030 (two 1sts & two swaps) could result in a top 5 pick (or multiple) to trade for starpower or draft starpower (as Scoot and Sharpe will still be 26 & 27 in 2030).

In the future, we'll be wanting to add the star forward to Scoot & Sharpe that we always wanted to get for Dame. Putting ourselves in the best position to have assets and numerous chances at doing so seems best. Punting on that route to get a high-quality role player right now that could walk or will likely get overpaid doesn't seem smart.

Chose a consistent direction and stick to it - rebuild.
 
TBpup said:
Because it's basically his personal mouthpieces saying it. His guy Haynes, and the agent's mouthpiece Shams.

No one else is coming out and saying that unless they are just repeating what those two said.
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I’m talking about him requesting a trade from the team if it isn’t Miami. His personal mouthpiece can say whatever he wants before the trade happens, because it’s probably a ploy to scare off other teams.

If he requested a trade from, say, Toronto, his brand takes a hit in the biggest way possible.
 
BankTeller said:
I’m talking about him requesting a trade from the team if it isn’t Miami. His personal mouthpiece can say whatever he wants before the trade happens, because it’s probably a ploy to scare off other teams.

If he requested a trade from, say, Toronto, his brand takes a hit in the biggest way possible.
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I doubt he would do it, but he is either condoning, or authorizing the message now. I didn't think he would do what he is doing now, so maybe wouldn't be surprised at what might happens next.
 
BonesJones said:
I do not want OG Anunoby as the focal point of a Dame trade. Dude either walks for nothing or we end up overpaying him and could be paying a starless forward duo a combined $70M a year.

If we plan on flipping him, it would need to be now, as I don't see him having more value mid-season with free agency coming up. He also wants more offensive responsibility and spending a season trying to please him in order to convince him to re-sign might get in the way of focusing on the development of Scoot, Sharpe, and Simons which is the most important thing this year.

I'd rather have Miami picks, have a better chance at having a top pick next year (because we're worse) and adding a future star to the Portland core on a rookie salary. Trade Jerami for whatever assets we can get. That'd open up cap space in the future which could be used to accumulate assets like rebuilding teams do. And then hopefully Miami can't recover from having no young core or picks to replace Lillard and Butler once they retire or decline. Having control of Miami picks from 2027-2030 (two 1sts & two swaps) could result in a top 5 pick (or multiple) to trade for starpower or draft starpower (as Scoot and Sharpe will still be 26 & 27 in 2030).

In the future, we'll be wanting to add the star forward to Scoot & Sharpe that we always wanted to get for Dame. Putting ourselves in the best position to have assets and numerous chances at doing so seems best. Punting on that route to get a high-quality role player right now that could walk or will likely get overpaid doesn't seem smart.

Chose a consistent direction and stick to it - rebuild.
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If the Blazers really want OG, clear some cap space from trading Grant and just overpay OG in the summer.

Agreed 100%. Ayton, if it’s Nurk and a role player from a third team, is low risk. Trading Dame for the opportunity to lose or overpay for OG this summer would be an L of epic proportions.
 
illmatic99 said:
Not sure you're grasping this. Dame not being onboard will dissuade Masai from making the offer. There is no "deal" without Dame being on board.
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Kawhi threatened not to play AFTER he was traded. Dame ain’t like that.

IMG_0594.jpeg
 
CJ_is_Gone said:
Being disgruntled & walking away after 1 season without compensation.

Sure they won a championship - but they were one lucky bounce away from being a second round exit team vs Philly.
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The game was tied. Toronto probably wins in OT even if he misses.
 
Question for the group: what if the raptors are trying to swing this trade without including OG or Barnes? I think they can cobble enough salary with Dick, Boucher, GT Jr., and OPJ.

Let's assume the number of picks are equal (though you could certainly value the raptors' future picks more highly than the Heat's). How would you compare that package to Miami's (assuming that Herro has been already been flipped to equalize picks with this hypothetical Toronto package)?

It'd be a one-year shot for Toronto as they would enter cap hell quickly if they were hoping to retain everyone the following year, but it is an interesting hypothetical.
 
illmatic99 said:
I have addressed this point. And I have good reason to believe this is straight from Goodwin's mouth.

https://theathletic.com/4883753/2023/09/22/nba-lillard-harden-trades-load-management-training-camp/


With Dame, I think the Harden-esque escalation wouldn’t happen unless he were dealt to a team like, say, Toronto, where he clearly doesn’t want to be. And for everyone who cites the Raptors’ Kawhi Leonard trade as an example of a team winning the risky bet on a player who wanted to be elsewhere, let’s not forget that Kawhi was only one season away from free agency at the time.

Lillard, by very significant contrast, has four very expensive seasons left on his contract (including a player option worth $63.2 million in 2026-27). It’s one thing to roll the dice for a season and hope it works out, and quite another to take on a deal worth $216 million and brace for the potentially disastrous fireworks that might unfold from there.
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I’m confused. Kawhi being a rental was good for them?
 
Mediocre Man said:
It’s light years different money in Miami than it would be in Toronto. The tax difference is staggering
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I was asking about that a day or two ago

216M over 4 years...and Dame gets millions on top of that in endorsement money; maybe a total of 65-70M/year...Canada vs Florida...Even allowing for a federal tax credit on a percentage of taxes paid in Canada, I'd think the difference could be several million dollars/year
 
BonesJones said:
I do not want OG Anunoby as the focal point of a Dame trade. Dude either walks for nothing or we end up overpaying him and could be paying a starless forward duo a combined $70M a year.
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You could flip Ayton at the deadline. You could keep Ayton.

You could flip Grant at the deadline. You could keep Grant.

You could flip OG at the deadline. You could keep OG.

This is a rebuild—keep the pieces you like and you can patiently move on at your leisure on the others. We can react to each individual move but there is no rush to finalize the roster—this team is going to be shit regardless, the west is insane this year.
 
BankTeller said:
If the Blazers really want OG, clear some cap space from trading Grant and just overpay OG in the summer.

Agreed 100%. Ayton, if it’s Nurk and a role player from a third team, is low risk. Trading Dame for the opportunity to lose or overpay for OG this summer would be an L of epic proportions.
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Yeah, that's definitely a better alternative. More assets and hoping to get him is better than having fewer assets and hoping he doesn't leave.

I'm cool with Ayton if Portland doesn't give up much in terms of picks/young players in order to get him. If it's Nurk and Martin to Phoenix on top of everything else Miami would give us, then that's fine with me. He's under contract and couldn't be flipped for multiple firsts like OG could.
 
Samuel said:
You could flip Ayton at the deadline. You could keep Ayton.

You could flip Grant at the deadline. You could keep Grant.

You could flip OG at the deadline. You could keep OG.

This is a rebuild—keep the pieces you like and you can patiently move on at your leisure on the others. We can react to each individual move but there is no rush to finalize the roster—this team is going to be shit regardless, the west is insane this year.
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I don't know. I could see an Ant/Tisse/OG/Grant/Ayton lineup being decent. But yeah...all three frontcourt players could easily be flipped for value at the deadline. The future would be incredibly uncertain, but potentially very bright.
 
Graduate32 said:
Question for the group: what if the raptors are trying to swing this trade without including OG or Barnes? I think they can cobble enough salary with Dick, Boucher, GT Jr., and OPJ.

Let's assume the number of picks are equal (though you could certainly value the raptors' future picks more highly than the Heat's). How would you compare that package to Miami's (assuming that Herro has been already been flipped to equalize picks with this hypothetical Toronto package)?

It'd be a one-year shot for Toronto as they would enter cap hell quickly if they were hoping to retain everyone the following year, but it is an interesting hypothetical.
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They can offer fewer picks than Miami right now. They can open up two though, which is as many as Miami can.

Miami would almost certainly be trading Herro to another team for assets, Toronto in this deal wouldn't be. So that's already more assets coming from Miami.

Jaquez & Jovic > Dick. GTJ has no value for me when we already have Scoot, Simon's, and Sharpe and GTJ would have one year left on his deal and probably walk.

Don't see how they possibly beat Miami with that sort of package.
 
Samuel said:
You could flip Ayton at the deadline. You could keep Ayton.

You could flip Grant at the deadline. You could keep Grant.

You could flip OG at the deadline. You could keep OG.

This is a rebuild—keep the pieces you like and you can patiently move on at your leisure on the others. We can react to each individual move but there is no rush to finalize the roster—this team is going to be shit regardless, the west is insane this year.
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Would rather flip OG now when he has more value instead of him helping us play our way into a worse lottery pick then potentially getting less for him at the deadline. They have years to identify the best starting frontcourt next to Scoot & Sharpe. Maximizing assets and having multiple chances at getting those guys as they come into the league makes more sense to me.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
I don't know. I could see an Ant/Tisse/OG/Grant/Ayton lineup being decent. But yeah...all three frontcourt players could easily be flipped for value at the deadline. The future would be incredibly uncertain, but potentially very bright.
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The thing on Joe's side, for once, is time. He's been in a hyper-leveraged situation since he took over, whether it's trying to win for dame with limited pieces, or trying to get under the cap, or trying to flip guards for 2-way win-now forwards. Did he make the best of those situations? You be the judge.

But this is why the Herro bit is important. Joe is trying to put himself in a situation where he isn't positionally blocking development—where other teams KNOW he has to make a move.

We can sit here and project a Presti-style rebuild onto the future, but it might take a tick to unwind and extract value from these assets even if the ultimate goal 'is' a rebuild. What if Ayton pops with the kids in a new environment? What if OG thrives with higher usage? What if Anfernee Simons finally adds rim pressure to his game and is a slightly different type of defensive player without Dame next to him? Time and evaluation are tools here and there's no longer a 33-year old franchise legend telegraphing your moves to the market before-the-fact.

And sure, next season you'll probably want to have a little more runway for Ant, Scoot and Shaedon to cook. But I think both will get plenty of additional run this season to grow their games, respectively.
 
BonesJones said:
They can offer fewer picks than Miami right now. They can open up two though, which is as many as Miami can.

Miami would almost certainly be trading Herro to another team for assets, Toronto in this deal wouldn't be. So that's already more assets coming from Miami.

Jaquez & Jovic > Dick. GTJ has no value for me when we already have Scoot, Simon's, and Sharpe and GTJ would have one year left on his deal and probably walk.

Don't see how they possibly beat Miami with that sort of package.
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Yeah, it really comes down to how much one values Gradey Dick (I actually like him a touch more than Jovic and Jaquez individually) and if you believe that the raptors's picks might hold more value than the those from the Heat.

I think it probably does fall short of Miami's offer assuming they are actually putting their assets on the table (which may not even be a given)
 
Samuel said:
help me out on this one because I'm scratching my head at this logic.

what?
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Jaquez, like Dick, is an NBA ready player. Jovic is a project.

If you look at Raptors’ forums, maybe were unhappy with Dick because of his low ceiling. You already drafted a low ceiling player in Murray, so it’s better to get a project who has a much higher ceiling than any of the guys mentioned.
 
Graduate32 said:
Yeah, it really comes down to how much one values Gradey Dick (I actually like him a touch more than Jovic and Jaquez individually) and if you believe that the raptors's picks might hold more value than the those from the Heat.

I think it probably does fall short of Miami's offer assuming they are actually putting their assets on the table (which may not even be a given)
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Depending on what OG could fetch from another team right now, a Toronto package could look just as good imo.
 
BankTeller said:
Jaquez, like Dick, is an NBA ready player. Jovic is a project.

If you look at Raptors’ forums, maybe were unhappy with Dick because of his low ceiling. You already drafted a low ceiling player in Murray, so it’s better to get a project who has a much higher ceiling than any of the guys mentioned.
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me, I’d collect the best shooter in the draft who has some potential upside defensively vs Jaquez who might have issues defending at the NBA level.

(and I don’t even like gradey dick that much)
 
wizenheimer said:
I was asking about that a day or two ago

216M over 4 years...and Dame gets millions on top of that in endorsement money; maybe a total of 65-70M/year...Canada vs Florida...Even allowing for a federal tax credit on a percentage of taxes paid in Canada, I'd think the difference could be several million dollars/year
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The salary definitely is affected, but with endorsement money...I have absolutely no clue, but I would think that would ultimately be determined by where you live. So if he lives full time in Oregon, and files his "normal" taxes here, then there likely wouldn't be any change there. Obviously, if he went to Florida, I'm sure he would adjust where he lives full time to there for the tax benefit, but his endorsement money has to be taxed differently than his normal basketball income, and I'd think it would be based on where you reside. Have no clue, that just seems like it'd make the most sense.
 
man some of you make no sense to me.

A lineup of Scoot/Ant/OG/Grant/Ayton with Sharpe and Thybulle off the bench is more balanced and versatile than anything we've put together around Dame since 2014. It has defense, passing, shooting, and we'd finally have a legit front court instead of the 6'3 surplus we always roll out there. It would also allow for Chauncey to finally play an aggressive style of defense that he seems inflexible to change even for personnel that couldn't play it.

But sure, let's flip guys for picks from good teams and go into purgatory once again.
 
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