Two shot at Holocaust Museum

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Paranoid much?

It sounds like an anti-Semite did it. Really sad.
 
The word is the security guard died from his wounds. As for the suspect, the word is that he was previously jailed for trying to execute a citizens arrest on the Federal Reserve Board of Governors.
 
maxiep said:
The word is the security guard died from his wounds. As for the suspect, the word is that he was previously jailed for trying to execute a citizens arrest on the Federal Reserve Board of Governors.
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Yeah I read that. In addition to this being tragic for the security guard's family and heartbreaking for Jews this could be a flash point event. I worry about greater gun control laws and anyone critical of the FED being labeled an anti-semite or conspiracy theorist. The FED is deadly dangerous to the sovereignty of this country.
 
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Remember this thread:

http://sportstwo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140075

Oh, the outrage, that the Department of Homeland Security could actually say that right wing extremist might be violent! Oh, the scandal! Oh, the scolding of the radio talking heads, all faithfully copied/pasted by the usual suspects on the board. Because everyone knows only Muslims and Bill Ayers are terrorists, right?

In the past week a doctor was murdered by a rightist with ties to extreme anti-abortion groups and a security guard at the Holocaust Museum was murdered by a rightist with ties to white supremacist groups - two groups mentioned in this report.

Since the murder of Dr. Tiller there has been an big upsurge in violence and threats against patients at clinics.

Anyone want to re-think their outrage?

I genuinely wonder some times if this president will live out his term. Because when hate is screamed over and over day after day and year after year sooner or later someone carries out the wishes of the screamers.
 
This doctor has been targeted multiple times IIRC. They were just able to carry it out finally.
 
crandc said:
Remember this thread:

http://sportstwo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140075

Oh, the outrage, that the Department of Homeland Security could actually say that right wing extremist might be violent! Oh, the scandal! Oh, the scolding of the radio talking heads, all faithfully copied/pasted by the usual suspects on the board. Because everyone knows only Muslims and Bill Ayers are terrorists, right?

In the past week a doctor was murdered by a rightist with ties to extreme anti-abortion groups and a security guard at the Holocaust Museum was murdered by a rightist with ties to white supremacist groups - two groups mentioned in this report.

Since the murder of Dr. Tiller there has been an big upsurge in violence and threats against patients at clinics.

Anyone want to re-think their outrage?

I genuinely wonder some times if this president will live out his term. Because when hate is screamed over and over day after day and year after year sooner or later someone carries out the wishes of the screamers.
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I think the "outrage" was that the report named all military veterans as likely recruits to right-wing causes. That said, not an appropriate time for "I told you so" IMO.
 
Turns out the guy is a 9/11 Truther as well. A bigot and he's delusional. Not a good combo, as those poor people at the museum found out today.
 
BTOWN_HUSTLA said:
no, it was a "BUSH IS BAD AND SET UP 9/11" thingy.
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I dunno, I see it as "government is bad and set up 9/11" thingy. And government=bad is usually more of a right-wing thingy. We don't know that it was Bush, after all. It could have been... (gasp)... the Rockefellers!

barfo
 
crandc said:
Remember this thread:

http://sportstwo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140075

Oh, the outrage, that the Department of Homeland Security could actually say that right wing extremist might be violent! Oh, the scandal! Oh, the scolding of the radio talking heads, all faithfully copied/pasted by the usual suspects on the board. Because everyone knows only Muslims and Bill Ayers are terrorists, right?

In the past week a doctor was murdered by a rightist with ties to extreme anti-abortion groups and a security guard at the Holocaust Museum was murdered by a rightist with ties to white supremacist groups - two groups mentioned in this report.

Since the murder of Dr. Tiller there has been an big upsurge in violence and threats against patients at clinics.
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I hadn't heard this. Why isn't DHS or the local authorities doing something about it? I'm pretty sure no one on these boards condones violence and threats against girls trying to get legal abortions.
Anyone want to re-think their outrage?

I genuinely wonder some times if this president will live out his term. Because when hate is screamed over and over day after day and year after year sooner or later someone carries out the wishes of the screamers.
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Uh, that seems supremely melodramatic, since I'm pretty sure that the current President is receiving MUCH MUCH MUCH less criticism, "hate", etc. than the former one, and I didn't see you voicing concern over W's safety. Heck, he had (and still has) a misinformed and potentially mentally-unbalanced housemom stalking him outside of his private residences for 3 years. But I digress.

I generally don't want to rethink my outrage. If these white supremacist groups, anti-abortion groups, and any other group mentioned in that report was sending out videos saying "Kill Dr. Tiller!" "Kill guards at the Holocaust Museum!" "Bomb abortion clinics!", then I would be standing right next to you in shouting my outrage at their continued existence. Instead, each time one of these (imo) isolated incidents happens, it further triggers someone (in this specific case, you, but could be anyone) saying that "rightist" (what the heck does that even mean, anyway?) people are inclined to be terrorists, and insinuating that radical Muslims who send videotapes threatening violence and destruction and Bill Ayers (who actually did it, and never paid a "debt to society") are maligned. That sickens me, since if even the people who seem so educated, informed and thoughtful on many other issues can justify making comments like yours on this issue -- i just won't say it. Do you think that this description
The gunman was identified by law enforcement officials as James W. von Brunn, who embraces various conspiracy theories involving Jews, blacks and other minority groups and at one point waged a personal war with the federal government.
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accurately describes someone balanced? Or a criminal?
Your original quote from the thread you posted
You mean like Eric Rudolph, who bombed the Atlanta Olympics, bombed a clinic, killing a police officer and maiming a nurse, and bombed a nightclub with a primarily lesbian clientele, injuring a number of people?
Or Oklahoma City?
Murder of doctors in their homes and clinics?
Dragging a man to death because he's black?
The report is talking about violent groups. Not people who vote Republican. Maybe you should read it?
Nah, too much trouble, so much easier to copy/paste from a web site.
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I was in agreement with. Yet you seem to be saying that the DHS report about military being recruited for right-wing extremist causes is now justified? Amazingly enough, though, McVeigh was hunted down, tried, and executed for his crimes. Rudolph was hunted down, tried, and only staved off execution by plea-bargaining his way into 5 consecutive life sentences. I imagine that Mr. Von Brunn and Dr. Tiller's murderer will spent the rest of their lives behind bars or in a mental institution. Yet Bill Ayers writes books, hangs out with future presidents, teaches children, and a whole host of other affronts to me personally, and is hailed as: what? (lazily going to wikipedia)
In 1997 Chicago awarded him its Citizen of the Year award for his work on the Chicago Annenberg Challenge project. [60]
William C. Ibershof, formerly the lead federal prosecutor in the Weather Underground case, wrote in 2008: "Although I dearly wanted to obtain convictions against all the Weathermen, including Bill Ayers, I am very pleased to learn that he has become a responsible citizen." [61]
Ayers was elected Vice President for Curriculum Studies by the American Educational Research Association in 2008. [62] William H. Schubert, a fellow professor at the University of Illinois at Chicago, wrote that his election was "a testimony of [Ayers'] stature and [the] high esteem he holds in the field of education locally, regionally, nationally, and internationally." [63]
Wall Street Journal columnist Thomas Frank praised Ayers as a "model citizen" and a scholar whose "work is esteemed by colleagues of different political viewpoints." [64]
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When the leaders of this country are using its military to actively pursue people who use the guise of radical muslim religion to threaten, plan and execute harm on others because of their creed, color, nationality or religion, that's protested against. I watched the BBC broadcast of Dr. Tiller's funeral, and was happy to not see any protesters there. That's more than I can say for many of the men and women who got killed attempting to protect us from "radical muslim extremists".

Look, it's horrible that a security guard was killed by an unbalanced person. It's horrible that Dr. Tiller was killed by someone who felt strongly enough about their beliefs to break the law in such a way. Each one of these persons should die, imo, and probably won't because of the reticence on the part of many to utilize the death penalty legally. Your characterization that right-wing people who participate in anti-abortion causes or white supremacy causes are violent is an affront to me as someone who volunteers at crisis pregnancy center, serves in the military and cares intensely about border patrol/control and everyone playing by the rules. And like I said, when it's coming from someone who generally I oppose in policy but respect in their opinion and reasons for it, what hope is there for me that the uninformed sheep who don't bother to think things through will ever understand?
 
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BrianFromWA said:
Amazingly enough, though, McVeigh was hunted down, tried, and executed for his crimes. Rudolph was hunted down, tried, and only staved off execution by plea-bargaining his way into 5 consecutive life sentences. I imagine that Mr. Von Brunn and Dr. Tiller's murderer will spent the rest of their lives behind bars or in a mental institution. Yet Bill Ayers writes books, hangs out with future presidents, teaches children, and a whole host of other affronts to me personally, and is hailed as: what? (lazily going to wikipedia)
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Well, the reason that Ayers is free is that the charges against him were dropped due to FBI misconduct. Not defending anything he did, but it seems to me his crimes were also arguably more minor than the others you mention. He was a leader of a violent organization, but it doesn't appear he killed anyone - or if he did it was indirectly, via advocating violence. All of the others you list personally killed people.

barfo
 
Oh, the outrage, that the Department of Homeland Security could actually say that right wing extremist might be violent! Oh, the scandal! Oh, the scolding of the radio talking heads, all faithfully copied/pasted by the usual suspects on the board. Because everyone knows only Muslims and Bill Ayers are terrorists, right?

In the past week a doctor was murdered by a rightist with ties to extreme anti-abortion groups and a security guard at the Holocaust Museum was murdered by a rightist with ties to white supremacist groups - two groups mentioned in this report.
Click to expand...

I also noticed that you didn't bring this up in your summary of murders in the last couple of weeks. Was it because it was a) a Muslim convert who did it, b) a soldier who was killed, or c) you hadn't seen any coverage of it?
 
barfo said:
Well, the reason that Ayers is free is that the charges against him were dropped due to FBI misconduct. Not defending anything he did, but it seems to me his crimes were also arguably more minor than the others you mention. He was a leader of a violent organization, but it doesn't appear he killed anyone - or if he did it was indirectly, via advocating violence. All of the others you list personally killed people.

barfo
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True statement about not killing anyone directly (and meriting a step below the others' punishment b/c of that), but the point was (IMO) that people like shooter want to bring up Muslims and Bill Ayers, when in reality it's rightists who are part of extremist groups who are terrorists. My point was, wouldn't you have to label him a "terrorist", after multiple bombings of public places for ideological gain?
 
BrianFromWA said:
I also noticed that you didn't bring this up in your summary of murders in the last couple of weeks. Was it because it was a) a Muslim convert who did it, b) a soldier who was killed, or c) you hadn't seen any coverage of it?
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None of the above. I did not bring it up because I was talking specifically about crimes that fit the profile of the DHS report and this does not. That's not to excuse or apolgize or praise this crime. It just is not part of the "set" as we say in mathematics. Not all crimes are. No one ever said they were.

Incidentally I have seen no peace, liberal, progressive or other groups praise this killer or say he's a hero or send him letters of support. I saw no liberal TV personalities say that military recruits deserve to die.

Try again.

As for so called Bush haters, the worst I heard was impeach and imprison. I never heard kill him. But there is a preacher in Orange County who publicly says he prays that Obama will die. He preaches to a congregation and has been on Fox Radio at least twice. Is there that big a gap between "I pray he dies" and "I pray someone kills him"?
 
BrianFromWA said:
True statement about not killing anyone directly (and meriting a step below the others' punishment b/c of that), but the point was (IMO) that people like shooter want to bring up Muslims and Bill Ayers, when in reality it's rightists who are part of extremist groups who are terrorists. My point was, wouldn't you have to label him a "terrorist", after multiple bombings of public places for ideological gain?
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I guess at this point I'd label him a former terrorist, since he doesn't seem to have been involved in such activities for the past 25 years or so.

barfo
 
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http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-...n-a-911-truther-who-hated-neocons-Bush-McCain

Holocaust Museum shooter von Brunn a 9/11 'truther' who hated 'neo-cons', Bush, McCain

The anti-semitism of von Brunn is the first thing one notices when visiting these bizarre websites. However, like those of most “white supremacists”, many of von Brunn’s political views track “Left” rather than “Right.” Clearly, a re-evaluation of these obsolete definitions is long overdue.

For example, he unleashed his hatred of both Presidents Bush and other “neo-conservatives” in online essays. As even some “progressives” such as the influential Adbusters magazine publicly admit, “neoconservative” is often used as a derogatory code word for “Jews”. As well, even a cursory glance at “white supremacist” writings reveals a hatred of, say, big corporations that is virtually indistinguishable from that of anti-globalization activists.

James von Brunn’s advocacy of 9/11 conspiracy theories also gives him an additional commonality with individuals on the far-left.

None of this will surprise readers of Jonah Goldberg’s bestseller Liberal Fascism: The Secret History of the American Left, From Mussolini to the Politics of Change , which clearly demonstrates that “fascism” of the kind advocated by the British National Party (BNP) and the likes of James W. von Brunn is just as likely to reflect “leftwing” views as “rightwing” ones.”
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barfo said:
I guess at this point I'd label him a former terrorist, since he doesn't seem to have been involved in such activities for the past 25 years or so.

barfo
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Back in the early eighties, in an interview with David Horowitz and Peter Collier, Bill Ayers remembered his reaction upon learning that he would not be prosecuted by the government for his bombing spree as a member of the Weather Underground. “Guilty as hell, free as a bird—America is a great country,” he exulted.

http://www.city-journal.org/2008/eon1006ss.html

Here's an interesting read on Ayers from a profile that coincidently appeared in the 9/11/01 print copy of the New York Times.

http://islet.org/horowitz/20010914.htm

"I don’t regret setting bombs," Ayers was quoted in the opening line of the Times profile; "I feel we didn’t do enough." In 1969, Ayers and his wife convened a "War Council" in Flint Michigan, whose purpose was to launch a military front inside the United States with the purpose of helping Third World revolutionaries conquer and destroy it.
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A registered Democrat who had the right-wing Weekly Standard on his hit list. Could our media be any more pathetic as they trumpet "right-wing terrorism". This guy is basically an older Kos Kid.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0609/Weekly_Standard_may_have_been_shooter_target.html

Weekly Standard may have been shooter target

FBI agents visited the offices of the conservative Weekly Standard magazine yesterday after a shooting at the Holocaust Memorial Museum and told employees they'd found the magazine's address

A senior Standard staffer confirmed the visit but declined to discuss it in detail. An FBI spokeswoman, Katherine Schweit , also declined to comment on the investigation.

Two other sources said two FBI agents arrived shortly after 5:00 p.m. Thursday at the 17th Street offices of the magazine. They told staffers that they had found the address of the magazine on a piece of paper associated with the shooter, James von Brunn, and asked whether the Standard had received any threats.

The magazine is about a mile north of the Holocaust Museum, and there's no other indication that von Brunn had targeted it. Von Brunn's published rants included attacks on "neocons," and the Standard has been at the heart of the neoconservative movement.
The suggestion that the Standard may have been a target complicates any view of the racist shooter in contemporary left-right terms. Von Brunn's white supremacist roots put him under the rubric of a "right-wing extremist," but the substance of his views -- which included everything from believing that President Bush may have been in on the September 11 attacks to denying that President Obama is an American citizen -- are too far on the fringe to fit into conventional political classification.

The focus on the Standard, though, appears to be of a piece with his central motivation: Anti-Semitism. In one essay, Von Brunn attacked "JEWS-NEOCONS-BILL O’REILLY," and the suggestion that neoconservatism is a specifically Jewish conspiracy is common on the racist fringe.
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PapaG said:
A registered Democrat who had the right-wing Weekly Standard on his hit list. Could our media be any more pathetic as they trumpet "right-wing terrorism". This guy is basically an older Kos Kid.
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Right.

That's why he blogged this over at the noted left/liberal site freerepublic.com:

Obama is missing!

The American People Demand to Know:

WHO SENT YOU???

Obama has lived for 48 years without leaving any footprints -- none! There is no Obama documentation -- no records -- no paper trail -- none -- this is no accident. It is being done on purpose with Media help - but to serve whom & why???

MISSING-HIDDEN DOCUMENTS:

Original, vault copy of Certificate of Live Birth in the USA -- Not Released (1 version hidden in Hawaii, Original found in Kenya)

Certificate of Live Birth -- Released - Proven Counterfeit (www.ObamaFiles.com)

Obama/Dunham marriage license -- Not released

Soetoro/Dunham marriage license -- Not released

Soetoro adoption records -- Not released

Fransiskus Assisi School School application -- Not Released

Punahou School records -- Not released

Selective Service Registration -- Released - Proven Counterfeit

Occidental College records -- Not released

Passport (Pakistan) -- Not released

Columbia College records -- Not released

Columbia thesis -- Not released

Harvard College records -- Not released

Harvard Law Review articles -- None (maybe 1, Not Signed)

Baptism certificate -- None

Medical records -- Not released

Illinois State Senate records -- None (Locked up to prohibit public view

Illinois State Senate schedule -- Lost (All other Illinois state senators' records are intact)

Law practice client list -- Not released

University of Chicago scholarly articles -- None

WHY DON'T WE SEE ONE WORD OF THIS IN ANY OF THE MEDIA?

Love him or hate him, we all remember how the press went to great lengths to find out every move that President Bush made ... finally unable to come up with anything factual, so they created it! When their accusations were proven empty, they refused to retract one word of the fraud they perpetrated on the American people.

Dan Rather lost his job over fraudulent documents, because common people like you & me reached out and ripped CBS to pieces. They couldn't stand the loss of sponsors OR viewers!

The same Media went to great lengths to scandalize & destroy Sarah Palin. She maintains a 91% approval rating among voters from all parties, thanks to the Internet and investigative journalists who don't work for the mainstream media.

NOW ------- The Supreme Court has scheduled a Conference for Dec 5th about Obama's

U. S. Citizenship. STILL, not a word about any of this from the Media. If it were not for the Internet and talk radio, American citizens would become the servants of a dishonest & conspiratorial Media.

THINK ABOUT IT. IT DIDN'T USED TO BE THIS WAY! How much longer are we going to sit on our hands & say not a word?

AND DON'T THINK THE MEDIA SIMPLY DOESN'T KNOW - THEY ARE GETTING POUNDED WITH EMAILS ABOUT IT!!!

Obama could not get a simple security clearance with the information the government has on him ---- NOBODY COULD!

NOW he is privy to every top secret America has!

What is going on??? WHERE ARE THE GOOD PEOPLE IN THIS COUNTRY - ARE YOU OUT THERE???

Submitted by: James W. von Brunn
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http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2141655/posts

[And note the hundreds of approving right-wing nut commenters, too...]

Watching the right try to turn this guy posthumously into a liberal is just pathetic, although not surprising.

SR
 
Stepping Razor said:
Right.

That's why he blogged this over at the noted left/liberal site freerepublic.com:


http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2141655/posts

[And note the hundreds of approving right-wing nut commenters, too...]

Watching the right try to turn this guy posthumously into a liberal is just pathetic, although not surprising.

SR
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Looks to me like a user named "wannabegeek" posted that article on FreeRepublic. If you read the link, the original von Brunn article is found here.

http://www.dn.no/forum/?display=topic&forum_id=1&topic_id=7349&jgo=

Apparently that's a Norweigen forum. Unless you are claiming that "wannabegeek" is von Brunn, I have to think that you don't know what you are talking about. Claiming that von Brunn blogs at the first website is a lie.
 
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