Politics Ukraine / Russia (6 Viewers)

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beast crnjo said:
Russia is in firm control of much of East Ukraine. Russia has been defending it, and Ukraine has been sustaining massive casualties in a useless effort to try and expel the Russians.

Now we see even the mainstream media, the same folks who kept priming you all to support this war, to send hundreds of billions to Ukraine, and told you Ukraine was winning, and admitting Ukraine can't push Russia out. On to the next war....

View attachment 59660
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Glenn Greenwald is not a reliable narrator.

barfo
 
beast crnjo said:
Money can't carry a gun or launch artillery. Wishing for this to continue is really just wishing for more Ukranaians to die.

Please try and snap yourselves out of this partisan thinking. I suppose once it's all public that Ukraine has surrendered you'll get to blame republicans, and not see that the voices who were against this from the start were correct, and the voices who convinced you this was good were lying.
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Nobody in this forum is wishing for war to continue. Defending oneself or helping one defend themselves is not instigating war. That should be the default of any free country.

Anything less is supporting hostility, aggression, and corruption. Anything less than supporting Ukraine is supporting far more killing and injustice.

The instigator in this situation is Russia. They are the only ones violating the borders of a sovereign nation and forcing war.

It's quite disgusting that you're supporting Russia.
 
beast crnjo said:
Money can't carry a gun or launch artillery. Wishing for this to continue is really just wishing for more Ukranaians to die.

Please try and snap yourselves out of this partisan thinking. I suppose once it's all public that Ukraine has surrendered you'll get to blame republicans, and not see that the voices who were against this from the start were correct, and the voices who convinced you this was good were lying.
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Who's expecting money to carry a gun? You do realize that 75 billion in aid to Ukraine does not mean that we just gave them a check for 75 billion dollars, right?
 
SlyPokerDog said:
There are literal Nazis in the US.

Yes, no one country has a monopoly on fucked up people with fucked up beliefs.

But since it's such a concern to you, you do know there are literal Nazis in Russia, right? I mean you do know this? I find it ironic how you seem so upset about Ukrainian Nazis but not Russian ones.

Putin’s fascists: the Russian state’s long history of cultivating homegrown neo-Nazis
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This is a poor false equivalency. They are within the upper echelons of their government. They have entire Nazi battalions fighting for them.
 
Proof that this is all Ukraine's fault! Does Ukraine care about families and traditional values? Obviously no! Putin just wants peace and families to be happy.

Putin declares ‘Year of the Family’
Russia will devote 2024 to promoting families and traditional values

Russian President Vladimir Putin signed a decree on Wednesday declaring 2024 the ‘Year of the Family’ and appointing a deputy prime minister to head a government commission that will spearhead the program.

The ‘Year of the Family’ initiative aims to “promote state policy in the field of family protection and preservation of traditional family values,” according to the document, which takes effect immediately.

The Russian government has been given until December 27 to set up a committee for implementing the ‘Year of the Family’, appoint its members, develop a plan of activities, and determine the source of funding for them.

https://www.rt.com/russia/587813-putin-year-family-2024/
 
beast crnjo said:
You all know Ukraine is sending women to the front line now? But oh no, they don't have a shortage of man power. "ban me" for speaking the truth....but you all have been lied to.

I tried to tell you....
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No, that is now being spun as a good thing, don’t you read the posts on here? When your women and elders have to go fight and die it’s because your country is super patriotic. It has nothing to do with the number of fighting age men or lack thereof.
 
jonnyboy said:
This is a poor false equivalency. They are within the upper echelons of their government. They have entire Nazi battalions fighting for them.
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Donald Trump? Federal police snatching up Portland protestors at random and hauling them to jail...

Trump having military beat protestors to clear a space for his photo op...
 
Phatguysrule said:
Donald Trump? Federal police snatching up Portland protestors at random and hauling them to jail...

Trump having military beat protestors to clear a space for his photo op...
Click to expand...

You are making exactly zero points here. Just insane liberal hyperbole and misunderstanding of what a Nazi is.
May as well throw in the obligatory “you’re a fascist” if we’re not even trying here.
 
jonnyboy said:
You are making exactly zero points here. Just insane liberal hyperbole and misunderstanding of what a Nazi is.
May as well throw in the obligatory “you’re a fascist” if we’re not even trying here.
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Donald Trump is certainly a fascist... That was the point.
 
bXn71bY.jpg
 
Most Ukrainians are doing eveything within their abilities to fight for their freedom, regardless of age or sex. However, about 20,000 young men eligible for the draft have left Ukraine to avoid the war.

Between 800,000 and 1 million Russian young men eligible for the draft have left Russia to avoid the war.
 
Biden-Funded Ukrainian Military Tortures, Kills, and EATS Innocent Russian Civilians

The Ukrainian military has abducted and tortured, maimed, killed, and consumed elderly Russian citizens from border settlements near the city of Gokovo, according to FSB agent Andrei Zakharov and gruesome video General Valery Zaluzhny, Ukraine’s commander in chief of armed forces, sent to the Russian Ministry of Defense.

Zakharov said Ukraine’s elite 10th Mountain Assault Brigade has made numerous border incursions since the start of Vladimir Putin’s Special Military Operation, each time abducting Russian citizens, including the elderly and young children, and dragging them across the border to face unimaginable, sadistic torture. Although the Russian army has interceded and prevented several raids, the 10th Mountain Brigade appears to have adopted U.S. insurgency tactics and has craftily learned to avoid Spetznas patrols.

“These monsters have spies. They know when and where our soldiers are patrolling and hit unprotected towns and villages. They kidnap men, women, and children and do terrible things to them like in the video,” Zakharov said.

The video, a sliver of which was shown to Real Raw News, shows a Ukrainian soldier chopping off a frail woman’s arm at the elbow with a machete. She screams as two soldiers pin her down, her stump of an arm spilling crimson blood on the ground. “Ty vse odno staryy,” or, “You’re old anyway,” a soldier says, then decapitates her.

In the second segment, a horse had been tied to each of a man’s limbs and set running in different directions. Ukrainian soldiers laugh uproariously as the man is ripped apart.

In the third, soldiers force Russian civilians to cross a minefield. A man refuses and is shot in the face. A second man nervously steps onto the field, takes twelve steps, and explodes. “Perekhreshchuyeshsya i ydesh dodomu,” or, “You can go home if you make it across,” a soldier tells a boy who looks about 11 years old. The boy successfully crosses the field and is told, “We take you home,” as a soldier adeptly enters the field—obviously knowing the path—and retrieves a finger from the man who had been blown apart. He puts the finger in his mouth, chews, and swallows. “They taste good,” he says.

Zakharov believes these occurrences have become commonplace.

Equally worrying is that the 10th Mountain Assault Brigade is now armed with U.S. army weapons—M16A3s, M27s, and XM7s—and vehicles—Bradley IFVs and Stryker infantry carrier vehicles—and is using them to terrorize innocent Russian citizens.

“Your fake president and the pig Zelenskyy make this happen,” Zakharov said. “Biden gives Zelenskyy billions and billions and billions of dollars and war machines to Zelenskyy and he use then to kill the innocent not fight us on the battlefield. And your Western media say nothing because they are complicit, but they make all the big deals about Israel and Hamas while the person Biden funds makes war crimes on our citizens,” he finished passionately.

He said Ukraine’s military has left countless children orphaned. In one village, packs of 50 and sometimes even 100 are skittering in mismatched shoes and muddy faces, thundering up to anyone they think has a morsel of food. Sometimes the Ukrainians kidnap the children; other times they leave the kids to fend for themselves.

“This must stop. If not for your U.S. money, Zelenskyy could not wage his secret war on our people. It is very evil,” Zakharov said.

https://realrawnews.com/2023/11/bid...es-kills-and-eats-innocent-russian-civilians/
 
Why would Ukrainians only eat elderly Russians? Old and tough. Young Russians would be more tender and flavorful.
 
With so much propaganda, I look for patterns of information that can be partially verified, such as by videos of real events.

This is debatable, but I believe a growing % of both the Russian soldiers, and their families want the war to end.

There are two unconfirmed reports of entire Russian units refusing to attack the Ukranians. There are real videos of a growing number of families protesting the war, but in a way that does not get them arrested.

The pattern is simple to understand. The Russian soldiers just want to go home to their families (as promised), and their families want them back home, but not in a box. The Russians are getting tired of this war.
 
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My post above was somewhat vague. I will try to give more detailed info as to why I believe the Russian people and soldiers are getting tired of the war. (I wish Putin would get tired of killing people)

Start with so many Russian soldiers that have surrendered without a fight, (17,000 reported by Ukraine)

They have volunteered much intel on the extremely high casualty rates, poor morale, bad conditions and extreme shortage of all supplies, including lack of food. There are videos of Russian soldiers surrendering to drones, just to get better treatment in a Ukrainian prison, and to stay alive.

Another key source of intel, for both sides, is listening in on cell phone calls. Ukranians know to make calls from areas away from their position. Because the location they call from will be shelled by the Russians in about 40 minutes from the start of the call.

There is a youtube channel that plays translated calls made by Russian soldiers to their families in Russia. Early on, the tone of the calls revealed that the ridicules Russian propaganda was working on the people in Russia, but not on the soldiers. Not any more.

Now most calls center around family members trying to get their soldiers home. Many are told by govt agencies that their son's and husband's are not in Ukraine, but at a base in Russia. Therefore they are not eligible for any leave, even if their enlistment time is completed.

One sad call I remember covered this topic. A Russian soldier was calling his mother from Ukraine, but she was being told he was in Russia. Then the son asked his mother how his aunt was doing. The aunts son, his cousin, was killed in Ukraine not far from him. His mother explaimed that when the officials arrived, they told his aunt, that his cousin was killed in a training exercise at a base in Russia, she would not get his body, nor was she eligible for any insurance payment. All she received for her son's death was some flowers and a bag of potatoes.

There are so many sad stories like this going around in Russia, it makes me wonder how much longer Putin can keep this illegal war going, fueled only by ridicules propaganda and lies that no one believes anymore.
 
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This is both funny and sad. Putin may have just made the final mistake that will break the backs of the people that still support him.

To help raise revenues, Putin just passed a law to greatly increase the tax on alcohol, some taxes have tripled.

The new taxes do not take affect until May, put in a country that has a 20%+ alcoholic rate, this is going to be hard for them to swallow. Especially since Putin already raised the taxes on alcohol earlier this year.
 
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SlyPokerDog said:
Biden-Funded Ukrainian Military Tortures, Kills, and EATS Innocent Russian Civilians

The Ukrainian military has abducted and tortured, maimed, killed, and consumed elderly Russian citizens from border settlements near the city of Gokovo, according to FSB agent Andrei Zakharov and gruesome video General Valery Zaluzhny, Ukraine’s commander in chief of armed forces, sent to the Russian Ministry of Defense.

Zakharov said Ukraine’s elite 10th Mountain Assault Brigade has made numerous border incursions since the start of Vladimir Putin’s Special Military Operation, each time abducting Russian citizens, including the elderly and young children, and dragging them across the border to face unimaginable, sadistic torture. Although the Russian army has interceded and prevented several raids, the 10th Mountain Brigade appears to have adopted U.S. insurgency tactics and has craftily learned to avoid Spetznas patrols.

“These monsters have spies. They know when and where our soldiers are patrolling and hit unprotected towns and villages. They kidnap men, women, and children and do terrible things to them like in the video,” Zakharov said.

The video, a sliver of which was shown to Real Raw News, shows a Ukrainian soldier chopping off a frail woman’s arm at the elbow with a machete. She screams as two soldiers pin her down, her stump of an arm spilling crimson blood on the ground. “Ty vse odno staryy,” or, “You’re old anyway,” a soldier says, then decapitates her.

In the second segment, a horse had been tied to each of a man’s limbs and set running in different directions. Ukrainian soldiers laugh uproariously as the man is ripped apart.

In the third, soldiers force Russian civilians to cross a minefield. A man refuses and is shot in the face. A second man nervously steps onto the field, takes twelve steps, and explodes. “Perekhreshchuyeshsya i ydesh dodomu,” or, “You can go home if you make it across,” a soldier tells a boy who looks about 11 years old. The boy successfully crosses the field and is told, “We take you home,” as a soldier adeptly enters the field—obviously knowing the path—and retrieves a finger from the man who had been blown apart. He puts the finger in his mouth, chews, and swallows. “They taste good,” he says.

Zakharov believes these occurrences have become commonplace.

Equally worrying is that the 10th Mountain Assault Brigade is now armed with U.S. army weapons—M16A3s, M27s, and XM7s—and vehicles—Bradley IFVs and Stryker infantry carrier vehicles—and is using them to terrorize innocent Russian citizens.

“Your fake president and the pig Zelenskyy make this happen,” Zakharov said. “Biden gives Zelenskyy billions and billions and billions of dollars and war machines to Zelenskyy and he use then to kill the innocent not fight us on the battlefield. And your Western media say nothing because they are complicit, but they make all the big deals about Israel and Hamas while the person Biden funds makes war crimes on our citizens,” he finished passionately.

He said Ukraine’s military has left countless children orphaned. In one village, packs of 50 and sometimes even 100 are skittering in mismatched shoes and muddy faces, thundering up to anyone they think has a morsel of food. Sometimes the Ukrainians kidnap the children; other times they leave the kids to fend for themselves.

“This must stop. If not for your U.S. money, Zelenskyy could not wage his secret war on our people. It is very evil,” Zakharov said.

https://realrawnews.com/2023/11/bid...es-kills-and-eats-innocent-russian-civilians/
Click to expand...
Yes, this is all 100% true, just like Putin's statement that they would never invade Ukraine.
 
oldfisherman said:
My post above was somewhat vague. I will try to give more detailed info as to why I believe the Russian people and soldiers are getting tired of the war. (I wish Putin would get tired of killing people)

Start with so many Russian soldiers that have surrendered without a fight, (17,000 reported by Ukraine)

They have volunteered much intel on the extremely high casualty rates, poor morale, bad conditions and extreme shortage of all supplies, including lack of food. There are videos of Russian soldiers surrendering to drones, just to get better treatment in a Ukrainian prison, and to stay alive.

Another key source of intel, for both sides, is listening in on cell phone calls. Ukranians know to make calls from areas away from their position. Because the location they call from will be shelled by the Russians in about 40 minutes from the start of the call.

There is a youtube channel that plays translated calls made by Russian soldiers to their families in Russia. Early on, the tone of the calls revealed that the ridicules Russian propaganda was working on the people in Russia, but not on the soldiers. Not any more.

Now most calls center around family members trying to get their soldiers home. Many are told by govt agencies that their son's and husband's are not in Ukraine, but at a base in Russia. Therefore they are not eligible for any leave, even if their enlistment time is completed.

One sad call I remember covered this topic. A Russian soldier was calling his mother from Ukraine, but she was being told he was in Russia. Then the son asked his mother how his aunt was doing. The aunts son, his cousin, was killed in Ukraine not far from him. His mother explaimed that when the officials arrived, they told his aunt, that his cousin was killed in a training exercise at a base in Russia, she would not get his body, nor was she eligible for any insurance payment. All she received for her son's death was some flowers and a bag of potatoes.

There are so many sad stories like this going around in Russia, it makes me wonder how much longer Putin can keep this illegal war going, fueled only by ridicules propaganda and lies that no one believes anymore.
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First, I wanted to thank you for being so well informed as to what is going on over there. Just want to question one little thing. Because Ukraine represents the light in this conflict, I want to clear up one thing. I don't want us to be like some on here who just throw out blatant falsehoods with no evidence. I don't think they have anywhere near 17,000 russian POWs. Although Ukraine puts a lot of effort into providing information to russians on how to surrender, in practical terms it is very difficult to surrender without being shot down by their own troops. It was a big event that 60 surrendered over a 20 day period on one front recently. I would be surprised if they have more than a couple thousand. BTW, russia is refusing to participate in prisoner exchanges any longer. Most likely hoping to use all the Ukrainian soldiers and civilians as hostages.
 
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Short update. russia is still continuing all out offensive against well entrenched Ukrainian positions and are losing 1000 troops a day on average over the last month. Haven't seen that they have gained more than a km on any front.
Ukraine has somehow destroyed a tunnel in the far east connecting russia and China. They just hit a big drone storage facility in russia with one of their own large drones. russian partisans are destroying railroad relay stations in the Moscow region. Ukraine hacked into Crimean TV stations and broadcast speeches by their president and intelligence agency head. Also it was confirmed this week that Ukraine used a Patriot system earlier this year to shoot down four russian airplanes.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
Biden-Funded Ukrainian Military Tortures, Kills, and EATS Innocent Russian Civilians

The Ukrainian military has abducted and tortured, maimed, killed, and consumed elderly Russian citizens from border settlements near the city of Gokovo, according to FSB agent Andrei Zakharov and gruesome video General Valery Zaluzhny, Ukraine’s commander in chief of armed forces, sent to the Russian Ministry of Defense.

Zakharov said Ukraine’s elite 10th Mountain Assault Brigade has made numerous border incursions since the start of Vladimir Putin’s Special Military Operation, each time abducting Russian citizens, including the elderly and young children, and dragging them across the border to face unimaginable, sadistic torture. Although the Russian army has interceded and prevented several raids, the 10th Mountain Brigade appears to have adopted U.S. insurgency tactics and has craftily learned to avoid Spetznas patrols.

“These monsters have spies. They know when and where our soldiers are patrolling and hit unprotected towns and villages. They kidnap men, women, and children and do terrible things to them like in the video,” Zakharov said.

The video, a sliver of which was shown to Real Raw News, shows a Ukrainian soldier chopping off a frail woman’s arm at the elbow with a machete. She screams as two soldiers pin her down, her stump of an arm spilling crimson blood on the ground. “Ty vse odno staryy,” or, “You’re old anyway,” a soldier says, then decapitates her.

In the second segment, a horse had been tied to each of a man’s limbs and set running in different directions. Ukrainian soldiers laugh uproariously as the man is ripped apart.

In the third, soldiers force Russian civilians to cross a minefield. A man refuses and is shot in the face. A second man nervously steps onto the field, takes twelve steps, and explodes. “Perekhreshchuyeshsya i ydesh dodomu,” or, “You can go home if you make it across,” a soldier tells a boy who looks about 11 years old. The boy successfully crosses the field and is told, “We take you home,” as a soldier adeptly enters the field—obviously knowing the path—and retrieves a finger from the man who had been blown apart. He puts the finger in his mouth, chews, and swallows. “They taste good,” he says.

Zakharov believes these occurrences have become commonplace.

Equally worrying is that the 10th Mountain Assault Brigade is now armed with U.S. army weapons—M16A3s, M27s, and XM7s—and vehicles—Bradley IFVs and Stryker infantry carrier vehicles—and is using them to terrorize innocent Russian citizens.

“Your fake president and the pig Zelenskyy make this happen,” Zakharov said. “Biden gives Zelenskyy billions and billions and billions of dollars and war machines to Zelenskyy and he use then to kill the innocent not fight us on the battlefield. And your Western media say nothing because they are complicit, but they make all the big deals about Israel and Hamas while the person Biden funds makes war crimes on our citizens,” he finished passionately.

He said Ukraine’s military has left countless children orphaned. In one village, packs of 50 and sometimes even 100 are skittering in mismatched shoes and muddy faces, thundering up to anyone they think has a morsel of food. Sometimes the Ukrainians kidnap the children; other times they leave the kids to fend for themselves.

“This must stop. If not for your U.S. money, Zelenskyy could not wage his secret war on our people. It is very evil,” Zakharov said.

https://realrawnews.com/2023/11/bid...es-kills-and-eats-innocent-russian-civilians/
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Sometimes, I just have to shake my head at both the creativity and depravity of the disturbed minds that conceive of such scenarios. The dude who writes all the stuff on that site is interesting to say the least.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Sometimes, I just have to shake my head at both the creativity and depravity of the disturbed minds that conceive of such scenarios. The dude who writes all the stuff on that site is interesting to say the least.
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The only verified info I have on cannibals is that russia has released a serial killer who killed and ate his victims. He was released as a reward for serving in the war against Ukraine.
 
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PtldPlatypus said:
Sometimes, I just have to shake my head at both the creativity and depravity of the disturbed minds that conceive of such scenarios. The dude who writes all the stuff on that site is interesting to say the least.
Click to expand...
People ask Stephen King, to his annoyance, where he gets his ideas. Which can certainly be gruesome. But he acknowledges they are fiction. And by all accounts he is in truth a nice person.

Those who invent shit and call it fact? Not so much.
 
UKRAINEFAN said:
First, I wanted to thank you for being so well informed as to what is going on over there. Just want to question one little thing. Because Ukraine represents the light in this conflict, I want to clear up one thing. I don't want us to be like some on here who just throw out blatant falsehoods with no evidence. I don't think they have anywhere near 17,000 russian POWs. Although Ukraine puts a lot of effort into providing information to russians on how to surrender, in practical terms it is very difficult to surrender without being shot down by their own troops. It was a big event that 60 surrendered over a 20 day period on one front recently. I would be surprised if they have more than a couple thousand. BTW, russia is refusing to participate in prisoner exchanges any longer. Most likely hoping to use all the Ukrainian soldiers and civilians as hostages.
Click to expand...

If you believe my 17,000 is off, then it probably is. I will try to find the pow report I saw, and try to figure what is going on. Thanks for the heads-up.
 
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