USA vs France, Sunday Aug. 15

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I see him being used in the low block a bit more when the likes of Steve Nash or Stephen Curry is guarding him. Teaching one dribble moves to attack the basket off swing passes to the weakside (not necessarily having to break down his man from the top of the key a la Roy).

It's not simply having to develop Point Forward skills before we can take advantage of his agility and length.

I'd love to see him develop a decent post-up game so that teams can't hide their weak, guard defenders on him. However, I only saw this once yesterday. Hopefully he is working on it.
 
Hell that game was hard to watch. When you have Boris Diaw basically being the playmaker, it is going to be a tough night.
 
Hell that game was hard to watch. When you have Boris Diaw basically being the playmaker, it is going to be a tough night.

Man, Diaw looked ridiculously out of shape out there. If I were a Charlotte fan I'd be pretty pissed off.
 
I agree with observations that Batum's game is going to look worse when he has no help from teammates. As another comparison to Pippen (I don't think Batum is the "next Pippen," that is to say, an inner circle Hall of Famer, but I think the stylistic similarities are striking), Pippen in his later years was more of a facilitator than a first option type. In his athletic prime, he was capable of being a go-to guy. By the time he reached Portland, he was only able to do that in bursts. But what he could do was create flow and make team offense better, due to how well he saw the game.

That's how I see Batum right now. Like late-career Pippen, in that he's not a go-to guy, but he can facilitate team offense. If all his teammates are massively overmatched, though, those skills will largely be wasted. You can't do a lot to facilitate a decimated offense and he's not the kind of guy who can carry an offense on his back.

In order to become a talent the caliber of Pippen, he'll need to become a guy who can be a go-to guy on offense. Right now, I wouldn't project that. But with Roy and, hopefully, a healthy Oden, Portland doesn't need that out of him. If he can be a "flow" guy and a great individual and team defender, he'll be an extremely important part of a championship-caliber core.
 
I agree with observations that Batum's game is going to look worse when he has no help from teammates. As another comparison to Pippen (I don't think Batum is the "next Pippen," that is to say, an inner circle Hall of Famer, but I think the stylistic similarities are striking), Pippen in his later years was more of a facilitator than a first option type. In his athletic prime, he was capable of being a go-to guy. By the time he reached Portland, he was only able to do that in bursts. But what he could do was create flow and make team offense better, due to how well he saw the game.

That's how I see Batum right now. Like late-career Pippen, in that he's not a go-to guy, but he can facilitate team offense. If all his teammates are massively overmatched, though, those skills will largely be wasted. You can't do a lot to facilitate a decimated offense and he's not the kind of guy who can carry an offense on his back.

In order to become a talent the caliber of Pippen, he'll need to become a guy who can be a go-to guy on offense. Right now, I wouldn't project that. But with Roy and, hopefully, a healthy Oden, Portland doesn't need that out of him. If he can be a "flow" guy and a great individual and team defender, he'll be an extremely important part of a championship-caliber core.

I really don't. Batum hasn't figured out how to make plays yet. Batum is a great defender. But on the offensive end of the court he is tentative and tends to completely dissappear. Pippen was mostly known for his ability to make plays happen on both ends of the court. Batum is purely one end of the court player right now, closer to a Bruce Bowen than a Pippen.
 
I really don't. Batum hasn't figured out how to make plays yet. Batum is a great defender. But on the offensive end of the court he is tentative and tends to completely dissappear. Pippen was mostly known for his ability to make plays happen on both ends of the court. Batum is purely one end of the court player right now, closer to a Bruce Bowen than a Pippen.

Can Nic even drink yet (in the USA)? This guy should be going into his junior year of college. Can you imagine what he'd be doing at that level? Guy has a skill set, agility and length to be a nightmare match up on a nightly basis. He can guard PG's and SG's. Can you imagine forcing an opponent to guard a Batum/Roy backcourt for stretches?

How much of it is on this coaching staff to develop these players skill sets and how much on just them doing it on their own in the off season? Cuz I am certainly not happy with the progression (or regression) of the likes of Batum, Rudy, LMA and marked drop in production from vets brought on board.

This coaching staff (pre-turnover) has not been conducive to overall team development.
 
I see him being used in the low block a bit more when the likes of Steve Nash or Stephen Curry is guarding him. Teaching one dribble moves to attack the basket off swing passes to the weakside (not necessarily having to break down his man from the top of the key a la Roy).

It's not simply having to develop Point Forward skills before we can take advantage of his agility and length.
I'm sure that you'll be thrilled to learn that Nic has been instructed by Nate to focus on his post up game this off season. According to NB, the plan is to immediately post him up if he's got a smallish guard on him

http://blog.oregonlive.com/blazers/2010/06/nic_batum_mcmillan_wants_me_to.html

STOMP
 
I'm sure that you'll be thrilled to learn that Nic has been instructed by Nate to focus on his post up game this off season. According to NB, the plan is to immediately post him up if he's got a smallish guard on him

http://blog.oregonlive.com/blazers/2010/06/nic_batum_mcmillan_wants_me_to.html

STOMP

Proof is in the pudding. Reminds me of the previous summer when Rudy was told he was going to be more of a play maker and run some PG. Hope it happens but the 5 year track record of the Nate regime has proven to not look much different regardless of the amount of "paint presence, scrappers, vets and shooters" he's requested over the years.
 
I'm sure that you'll be thrilled to learn that Nic has been instructed by Nate to focus on his post up game this off season. According to NB, the plan is to immediately post him up if he's got a smallish guard on him

http://blog.oregonlive.com/blazers/2010/06/nic_batum_mcmillan_wants_me_to.html

STOMP

(Nate) said (to Batum), “Each year, you have done more than what is expected, so next year it’s on you to be even better.”

I guess this answers my question on how much the coaching staff puts on themselves to evolve talent.
 
Players improve the most in the off-season, not during it.

I totally agree. Would be nice to have coaches helping during the off season besides the encouragement of “Each year, you have done more than what is expected, so next year it’s on you to be even better".
 
I totally agree. Would be nice to have coaches helping during the off season besides the encouragement of “Each year, you have done more than what is expected, so next year it’s on you to be even better".

Coaches have helped the players on Portland get better during the summer. So.....

Also, Batum is playing for France right now, and is coming off rehab work. I'm sure Batum worked with some coach at some point, and if not, that's on him..

While the Blazers help these guys, they certainly don't have to hold their hands the whole summer. It definitely is on the players themselves to get better, and that goes for every player.
 
Proof is in the pudding. Reminds me of the previous summer when Rudy was told he was going to be more of a play maker and run some PG.
well he did put the ball more in Rudy's hands to start last year, but dude struggled mightily with his health and game, and eventually had back surgery. Was Greg's knee injury Nate's fault too?

STOMP
 
I totally agree. Would be nice to have coaches helping during the off season besides the encouragement of “Each year, you have done more than what is expected, so next year it’s on you to be even better".
isn't that why the coach designs workout regimens for the individual players and their staff of coaches and trainers? It's not like they're expecting Nic to go out on his own dime and hire a trainer or focus on some things while playing pickup at the Y

STOMP
 
Can Nic even drink yet (in the USA)? This guy should be going into his junior year of college. Can you imagine what he'd be doing at that level? Guy has a skill set, agility and length to be a nightmare match up on a nightly basis. He can guard PG's and SG's. Can you imagine forcing an opponent to guard a Batum/Roy backcourt for stretches?

How much of it is on this coaching staff to develop these players skill sets and how much on just them doing it on their own in the off season? Cuz I am certainly not happy with the progression (or regression) of the likes of Batum, Rudy, LMA and marked drop in production from vets brought on board.

This coaching staff (pre-turnover) has not been conducive to overall team development.

I am not so sure on how he would be doing. It could be better than current development, it might not be. I see guys come into the league younger than 21 and score like mad all the time. They definitely worked on the offensive side of the ball more than Batum did. I also remember last year the coaching staff reigned in Batum when he started looking to score, which I think was a bad move. The team was offensively challenged, they needed more scoring. They should have just stood back, and let it happen.
 
I'm finding this thread a little hard to follow (aside from the massive o-live segue) how did any of you guys make any hard observations about an individual player when it was clear that France was completely overwhelmed and over matched? All I could pull out of that mess was Nic was trying play off the ball and deferred to De Colo and Diaw and did his best to keep his head above water while the boat sank around him. That's a bad French team with with no depth and fairly poor point guard play . . .

I don't know if this response was concerning my post, but most all the observations I made (besides the forced passes part) were consistent with what I've always thought about Nic. Sure, the environment wasn't ideal to see if he has improved at all, regardless, it was still pretty easy to pick out the things he still needs to work on.
 
Proof is in the pudding. Reminds me of the previous summer when Rudy was told he was going to be more of a play maker and run some PG. Hope it happens but the 5 year track record of the Nate regime has proven to not look much different regardless of the amount of "paint presence, scrappers, vets and shooters" he's requested over the years.

What season where you watching?

Rudy DID get the ball early in the year and he stunk up the joint. Then, he got hurt. Geeeeeezzzuss. Put a friggin cap in it already. We get it. Nate is the anti-christ. The fact he has a job is a sign. Blah. Blah.

Got anything else to add?
 
I wasn't able to watch the game. That is a terrible stat line. Did he look as bad as that line indicates?

A better statement as a whole would be the whole french team looked terrible. All their shots were just crap jacked up with no rhyme or reason. Imagine an offense where it is comprised of getting the ball up the floor, deferring it to an exremely overweight Diaw, whose job it is to make something happen, nothing happens, and then he throws a flaming bag to one of his team mates who jacks up a shot barely in time, and you have the french offense to a T.
 
What season where you watching?

Rudy DID get the ball early in the year and he stunk up the joint. Then, he got hurt. Geeeeeezzzuss. Put a friggin cap in it already. We get it. Nate is the anti-christ. The fact he has a job is a sign. Blah. Blah.

Got anything else to add?

Nope, you did a great job framing Nate as a championship caliber coach. If Rudy got the ball, Nate's gold.
 
I wasn't able to watch the game. That is a terrible stat line. Did he look as bad as that line indicates?

I didn't think he looked as bad as the stat line indicates. I'm pretty sure he had more than 4 rebs. However, it did look like he wasn't all that interested in the game. His defense was much more lackadaisical than we are used to seeing, and on offense he looked convinced that his teammates wouldn't be able to accomplish anything anyway.
 
Batum is a kid, and the coaching staff needs to help him develop his game. Rudy is a vet, and needs to take responsibility for his own performance.
 
I agree. There's not much you can do when your team doesn't have a true ball handler and your opponent is throwing half court presses at you. They were using Boeheims zone defense and nobody was attacking. What good is your offense going to do when no one even looks to attack the zone, instead they stand around the 3 point line chucking the ball around like a hot potatoe.

To me, Batum's play was a product of the system which France was playing. There was no system, it looked like shit ball to me.
 
I didn't think he looked as bad as the stat line indicates. I'm pretty sure he had more than 4 rebs. However, it did look like he wasn't all that interested in the game. His defense was much more lackadaisical than we are used to seeing, and on offense he looked convinced that his teammates wouldn't be able to accomplish anything anyway.

That's a pretty fair description. He knew the buzz saw his team was about to get into. He seemed to have a pretty good first quarter, but after that he just seemed to give up.

I'm not entirely sure I blame him. When you see Diaw show up so ridiculously out of shape, and you see Turiaf and Parker out, and you realize he's just recovering from injury, it's hard to get that motivated in a game that doesn't really matter in the middle of summer. It was the kind of game an older Scottie Pippen would've coasted on, too.
 
I didn't think he looked as bad as the stat line indicates. I'm pretty sure he had more than 4 rebs. However, it did look like he wasn't all that interested in the game. His defense was much more lackadaisical than we are used to seeing, and on offense he looked convinced that his teammates wouldn't be able to accomplish anything anyway.

Excellent. This only makes Batum long for getting back to the Blazers where he can be on the court with studs who care and resume his role as a glue-type player. Batum is a good player to have on a good team. Batum is not a D-Wade type that can carry a team with holes, playing lots of 1 on 4 offensively.

This experience is the opposite of what happened to Rudy when he became an international star with the high powered Spanish team, only to find it difficult to play a different role on the Blazers. This time, Batum will be happy to go back to his old role.
 
I don't know if this response was concerning my post, but most all the observations I made (besides the forced passes part) were consistent with what I've always thought about Nic. Sure, the environment wasn't ideal to see if he has improved at all, regardless, it was still pretty easy to pick out the things he still needs to work on.

I'm not singling anybody out, I just saw a whole lot of really extreme points being made on both sides and I was just a little floored that people were able to get that much out of what was on the TV yesterday ...
 
I wonder if Batum will command a big salary next year and if GO plays like we all hope . . . can you give a max salary to GO and a big contract to Batum with Roy and LA's contracts?

I guess if your PA, anything is possible, but at some point even PA will draw the line on total player salary . . . I think.
 
I wonder if Batum will command a big salary next year and if GO plays like we all hope . . . can you give a max salary to GO and a big contract to Batum with Roy and LA's contracts?

I guess if your PA, anything is possible, but at some point even PA will draw the line on total player salary . . . I think.

Thats when you consider moving LMA for a player with similar abilities, but a smaller contract. Like Kevin Love :)
 
Thats when you consider moving LMA for a player with similar abilities, but a smaller contract. Like Kevin Love :)

Yeah ... but then Love is due for an extension the year after that (and on it goes).

I do think with Camby and Miller set to expire in the very near future, it's going to make contract extensions for some of the younger guys like Oden and Batum much easier to stomach.
 
Yeah ... but then Love is due for an extension the year after that (and on it goes).

I do think with Camby and Miller set to expire in the very near future, it's going to make contract extensions for some of the younger guys like Oden and Batum much easier to stomach.
Joel expires even sooner... but with those guys off the books, how will our collective stomachs handle whoever is getting their minutes?

If PA's to double down in support of the headline guys to the tune of going deep into the lux tax for a while, it's time for them to put up a great season. Another season of ifs and buts and I'd understand if the club's decision is to keep the dollars within reason.

STOMP
 

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