OT Why does the IRS need $80 billion? Just look at its cafeteria.

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Phatguysrule said:
I did.
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Phatguysrule said:
They could pretty easily copy many other countries. They know how much taxes everybody with W2 jobs owe, and if they qualify for the earned income tax credit. It's not rocket science
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What if w2s are filed incorrectly by employers (happens all the time). Or how much money was made outside of w2 jobs? How will the IRS know who gets to claim the child for the EITC? How will they know if the taxpayer is married or single that year and if their child lived with them that year or not?

What if these taxpayers verify the income numbers they gave them and the IRS determines they verified incorrectly? (Very likely to happen if so many folks mess up as is).
 
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barfo said:
We have to be able to do more than one thing at a time as a country, we have more than one problem.

And collecting more tax revenue can help pay for drug interdiction/treatment/however you want to address the fentanyl problem.

barfo
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Yeah, thats common since, big gove doing more than one thing at a time, but imo we havent prioritized shutting down fetanyl and addressing the death rate from opioids. Do you think we have done enough?
 
EL PRESIDENTE said:
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I don't know, maybe they filled the job.

That division arrests people for criminal tax fraud. Do we really think it is a good idea for unarmed law enforcement officers to try to arrest people, given the number of people in this country armed with guns and/or katanas?

barfo
 
Hoopguru said:
Yeah, thats common since, big gove doing more than one thing at a time, but imo we havent prioritized shutting down fetanyl and addressing the death rate from opioids. Do you think we have done enough?
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Dunno. What more do you think can be done?

barfo
 
barfo said:
Dunno. What more do you think can be done?

barfo
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Use special forces to target the cartels and importers from China.
Use armed services at port of entries to improve detection.
When someone is busted for peddling fetanyl, zero tolerance. Us same scare tactic as IRS.

The amount of fetanyl to kill 10,000 and more can be carried in a work out bag. Its terrorism against innocent lives.
If it was a priority there would be positive results in stopping it more so than what happening now.
 
Hoopguru said:
Use special forces to target the cartels and importers from China.
Use armed services at port of entries to improve detection.
When someone is busted for peddling fetanyl, zero tolerance. Us same scare tactic as IRS.

The amount of fetanyl to kill 10,000 and more can be carried in a work out bag. Its terrorism against innocent lives.
If it was a priority there would be positive results in stopping it more so than what happening now.
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I think we all know what has to happen:
craiyon_161925_border_patrol_seizing_fentanyl_from_slypokerdog_br_.png
 
SlyPokerCat said:
What if w2s are filed incorrectly by employers (happens all the time). Or how much money was made outside of w2 jobs? How will the IRS know who gets to claim the child for the EITC? How will they know if the taxpayer is married or single that year and if their child lived with them that year or not?

What if these taxpayers verify the income numbers they gave them and the IRS determines they verified incorrectly? (Very likely to happen if so many folks mess up as is).
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The website review would handle pretty much all of this. Each kid could only be applied to 1 return. This is a simple rule in the database and no exceptions would be allowed.

The IRS would have the correct w2 info from the employers of the vast majority of the people. It wouldn't change unless the people had proof that it should.

Then there is nothing to audit. The proof is already there.
 
Phatguysrule said:
The website review would handle pretty much all of this. Each kid could only be applied to 1 return. This is a simple rule in the database and no exceptions would be allowed.

The IRS would have the correct w2 info from the employers of the vast majority of the people. It wouldn't change unless the people had proof that it should.

Then there is nothing to audit. The proof is already there.
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Run for congress man. You have answers to solve problems so simply. It would be a waste for you not to help our nation.
 
SlyPokerCat said:
Run for congress man. You have answers to solve problems so simply. It would be a waste for you not to help our nation.
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I wouldn't win the election. I don't have the money or flesh pressing personality.

And I don't kiss ass well enough to gain the support of an alliance.

In order to run for congress as a Democrat or a Republican you have to commit to fundraising 30-40hrs per week throughout your campaign and term soliciting money from a list your party gives you in eschange for promises. If you don't do that, and are not independently wealthy you will not get the support of the party and will not be invited to any committees.

This means none of your platform will have support and will therefore not be successful. You will get nothing done, be a failure, and then be voted out after your first term.

I despise those games and will not participate in them.
 
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Phatguysrule said:
This would be a huge step forward.

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You linked an extremely old tweet that didn't bring anything up so I had to look it up myself for 2022.

I don't really see the steps they are talking about changing audit numbers from folks that get audited. Maybe eventually, the EITC would be adjusted less, whatever they build wouldn't be bullet proof but through time hopefully would bring those numbers down. Filing directly with the IRS is fine. It is going to take an enormous amount of time for them to implement it and work out the kinks.

Tax day may have to change to later in the year if they want to use data already reported to them. Information like w-2's aren't due until like the end of January. They won't be able to immediately have that info ready for filers on February 1st.
 
SlyPokerCat said:
You linked an extremely old tweet that didn't bring anything up so I had to look it up myself for 2022.

I don't really see the steps they are talking about changing audit numbers from folks that get audited. Maybe eventually, the EITC would be adjusted less, whatever they build wouldn't be bullet proof but through time hopefully would bring those numbers down. Filing directly with the IRS is fine. It is going to take an enormous amount of time for them to implement it and work out the kinks.

Tax day may have to change to later in the year if they want to use data already reported to them. Information like w-2's aren't due until like the end of January. They won't be able to immediately have that info ready for filers on February 1st.
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My bad. Updated to the more recent one. Not sure how that old link got in there.

The Tax Filing Simplification Act makes several changes to simplify and decrease the costs of the tax filing process for millions of American taxpayers by:

Prohibiting the IRS from entering into agreements that restrict its ability to provide free online tax preparation or filing services.

Directing the IRS to develop a free, online tax preparation and filing service that would allow all taxpayers to prepare and file their taxes directly with the federal government instead of being forced to share private information with third parties.

Enhancing taxpayer data access by allowing all taxpayers to download third-party-provided tax information that the IRS already has into a software program of their choice, saving time and decreasing the risk of math errors on W-2 income or CTC payments that lead to significant processing delays.

Directing the IRS to expand the CTC non-filer tool to cover other tax benefits, especially the EITC, by March 1, 2023.

Allowing eligible taxpayers with simple tax situations to choose a return-free option, which provides a pre-prepared tax return with income tax liability or refund amount already calculated.

Mandating these data and filing tools be made available through a secure online function and requires any participating individual to verify his or her identity before accessing tax data.

Reducing tax fraud by getting third-party income information to the IRS earlier in the tax season, allowing the agency to cross-check this information before issuing refunds.
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They already have most of that data from companies doing quarterly filings.

Again, many first world countries do this. It's not difficult.
 
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Phatguysrule said:
My bad. Updated to the more recent one. Not sure how that old link got in there.



They already have most of that data from companies doing quarterly filings.

Again, many first world countries do this. It's not difficult.
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I completely agree with this - most people should not have to file tax returns at all, or at most they should be able to log in, and check a checkbox that says 'yes, I agree with the IRS's calculation of my tax liability'. It's a huge undertaking for an agency that's been hobbled by lack of funding for any sort of innovation whatsoever, but it is definitely the direction that they should be going.

I would guess, though, that a side effect of this will be to cause third-party tax software to go up dramatically in price, because the customer base will be a fraction of what it is now.

barfo
 
barfo said:
I completely agree with this - most people should not have to file tax returns at all, or at most they should be able to log in, and check a checkbox that says 'yes, I agree with the IRS's calculation of my tax liability'. It's a huge undertaking for an agency that's been hobbled by lack of funding for any sort of innovation whatsoever, but it is definitely the direction that they should be going.

I would guess, though, that a side effect of this will be to cause third-party tax software to go up dramatically in price, because the customer base will be a fraction of what it is now.

barfo
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That's okay though. The people who need it should be the ones who cover the cost. Especially since they are the ones who can afford it.
 
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Phatguysrule said:
My bad. Updated to the more recent one. Not sure how that old link got in there.



They already have most of that data from companies doing quarterly filings.

Again, many first world countries do this. It's not difficult.
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What info do you think they have from quarterly filings? They get a breakdown on Form 941 of their entire companies payroll for that quarter, but nothing about each individual taxpayer. And those are filed wrong ALL THE TIME. Payroll companies have zero idea what or how payroll affects a tax return so they mess things up.

The annual return and 4th quarter payroll filings are due like the same time the W-2 is.
 
barfo said:
I would guess, though, that a side effect of this will be to cause third-party tax software to go up dramatically in price, because the customer base will be a fraction of what it is now.

barfo
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Tax preparers don't charge that much for someone that only has a w-2 unless it is a brick and mortar h&r block type or a huge cpa firm. Maybe $100-200 depending who it is.

Turbotax and h&r block don't make that much if you file it yourself either. Every year h&r block at home is like $30 for their basic software and they let you file 5 federal returns for that.
 
Phatguysrule said:
That's okay though. The people who need it should be the ones who cover the cost. Especially since they are the ones who can afford it.
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But I don wanna pay more! Wah!

No, you are right, it's ok.

barfo
 
SlyPokerCat said:
Turbotax and h&r block don't make that much if you file it yourself either. Every year h&r block at home is like $30 for their basic software and they let you file 5 federal returns for that.
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Tax prep software in total is an $11B per year business. Yes, it doesn't cost each taxpayer much to use (even if you get all the bells and whistles, it's only around $100-200), but there are a huge number of customers.

barfo
 
barfo said:
Tax prep software in total is an $11B per year business. Yes, it doesn't cost each taxpayer much to use (even if you get all the bells and whistles, it's only around $100-200), but there are a huge number of customers.

barfo
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I don't disagree. I'm just saying there are multiple options for people to file if they simply have a w-2 and their returns aren't complicated at all that barely cost anything as is (not including the free options).
 
SlyPokerCat said:
I don't disagree. I'm just saying there are multiple options for people to file if they simply have a w-2 and their returns aren't complicated at all that barely cost anything as is (not including the free options).
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And I don't disagree with that.

barfo
 
SlyPokerCat said:
I don't disagree. I'm just saying there are multiple options for people to file if they simply have a w-2 and their returns aren't complicated at all that barely cost anything as is (not including the free options).
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The problem is, that encourages them to lobby for more complicated tax law. Which is exactly what they do.

The incentives are wrong.
 
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