Ayton

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DA was very good against the Bulls, and some of our friendly neighborhood Blazers fans are blaming Deandre for the loss.... lolol
Blazer guards never ever have bad nights... ever. Never ever.
 
Whyachi said:
Deandre credits communication with his teammates is improving his play. Getting him the ball in better spaces.

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Sounds as if he is willing to listen and to learn. Does it also sound like guys like Brogdon giving him better coaching than the guys who get paid for it?
 
UKRAINEFAN said:
Sounds as if he is willing to listen and to learn. Does it also sound like guys like Brogdon giving him better coaching than the guys who get paid for it?
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I don't think it sounded like Brogdon's advice was necessarily better than the coaches', just that he was also helping.
It seems to me that it needs to come from both. Ayton mentioned chemistry and he was right. All these different lineups affect it....and cause more turnovers.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
I don't think it sounded like Brogdon's advice was necessarily better than the coaches', just that he was also helping.
It seems to me that it needs to come from both. Ayton mentioned chemistry and he was right. All these different lineups affect it....and cause more turnovers.
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But ... his free throws ....
 
UKRAINEFAN said:
Sounds as if he is willing to listen and to learn. Does it also sound like guys like Brogdon giving him better coaching than the guys who get paid for it?
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yaaa, i didn't want to bring that up. I harp on Billups way too much. But Casey asked DA if Chauncey changed up the playbook, and DeAndre thanked his teammates and didn't want to throw a cookie into the Billups "improvements" mixing bowl. Though Casey bragged about Chauncey's amazing coaching in the post game presser anyways.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Serious question, last night Ayton had quite a few dunks.....so many of his shots were at the basket. He also had zero free throw attempts. So was that a negative for those debating the importance of drawing fouls?
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He sure isn't drawing fouls. I'm not sure he didn't get fouled a few times though?
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Serious question, last night Ayton had quite a few dunks.....so many of his shots were at the basket. He also had zero free throw attempts. So was that a negative for those debating the importance of drawing fouls?
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I guess that's directed at me

anyway, there was a discussion going on about Ayton and FT's; it had turned to a comparison of Ayton vs Przybilla and mid-range shots IIRC. I joined the conversation and simply pointed out that Ayton had one of the lowest FT rates for C's/bigs in the league, and did so by comparing his rate to other bigs. And, I said I thought the ability to draw fouls and get to the line was an important component of a big man's game, for several reasons (like scoring actual easy points; getting his team into the bonus earlier; getting the opposing rim protector in foul trouble) . I didn't make the numbers up but I did say I thought that was a weakness in his game.

I was basing that on Ayton's career and his season in Portland; not last night's game
 
wizenheimer said:
I guess that's directed at me

anyway, there was a discussion going on about Ayton and FT's; it had turned to a comparison of Ayton vs Przybilla and mid-range shots IIRC. I joined the conversation and simply pointed out that Ayton had one of the lowest FT rates for C's/bigs in the league, and did so by comparing his rate to other bigs. And, I said I thought the ability to draw fouls and get to the line was an important component of a big man's game, for several reasons (like scoring actual easy points; getting his team into the bonus earlier; getting the opposing rim protector in foul trouble) . I didn't make the numbers up but I did say I thought that was a weakness in his game.

I was basing that on Ayton's career and his season in Portland; not last night's game
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Actually no it was not directed to you. I looked back and it was more about labeling Ayton soft because he doesn't get fouled. In his last two games since that discussion, he has had more dunks ...yet still few free throw attempts. What I see is that once he gets the ball inside, he is quick to dunk. There is nothing they can do to stop it since he can shoot free throws well.

I think centers that draw the most fouls are the ones that put the ball on the floor and back their man down. And for me, I don't like it when centers dribble. The less the better IMO. Too many bad things happen when they put the ball on the floor.......unless you are Jokic or Embiid.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
I think centers that draw the most fouls are the ones that put the ball on the floor and back their man down. And for me, I don't like it when centers dribble. The less the better IMO. Too many bad things happen when they put the ball on the floor.......unless you are Jokic or Embiid.
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You know Nurk used to do this pretty well. Better when he was pissed off a bit. Seems he did a lot of things better when he was turning green/angry (you won't like me when I'm angry) Nurk.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Actually no it was not directed to you. I looked back and it was more about labeling Ayton soft because he doesn't get fouled. In his last two games since that discussion, he has had more dunks ...yet still few free throw attempts. What I see is that once he gets the ball inside, he is quick to dunk. There is nothing they can do to stop it since he can shoot free throws well.

I think centers that draw the most fouls are the ones that put the ball on the floor and back their man down. And for me, I don't like it when centers dribble. The less the better IMO. Too many bad things happen when they put the ball on the floor.......unless you are Jokic or Embiid.
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it depends on how effective they are with their post-up moves. Kevin McHale was a human post-up machine and maybe the best at it of all time. But yeah, a big man dribbling in traffic can be a turnover waiting to happen

I don't think Ayton is soft...and that was the very first thing I said in that post I got a lot of heat for. Ayton takes a lot of mid-range shots and he doesn't do a lot of pump fakes that tend to draw fouls. He seems to work a lot of spin moves and straight up jump shots fade-away shots. He certainly doesn't fish for whistles and in fact seems to avoid contact.

he's averaged a shade under 1.35 points/shot and that's decent efficiency in the NBA. I'm not sure how that stacks up against other NBA bigs. I just think he'd be better, and the team would be better off, if he drew more shooting fouls
 
kjironman1 said:
You know Nurk used to do this pretty well. Better when he was pissed off a bit. Seems he did a lot of things better when he was turning green/angry (you won't like me when I'm angry) Nurk.
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Actually, I had Nurk in mind when I said I prefer they didn't put the ball on the floor. Granted there were times when he was very good at it, but I had to hold my breath when he did it late in games. Between getting the ball slapped away or picking up offensive fouls, the potential for a turnover increased when he dribbled.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Serious question, last night Ayton had quite a few dunks.....so many of his shots were at the basket. He also had zero free throw attempts. So was that a negative for those debating the importance of drawing fouls?
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I actually thought he was fouled at least twice going up for buckets, including one of his dunks, but didn't get the call.
 
wizenheimer said:
I guess that's directed at me

anyway, there was a discussion going on about Ayton and FT's; it had turned to a comparison of Ayton vs Przybilla and mid-range shots IIRC. I joined the conversation and simply pointed out that Ayton had one of the lowest FT rates for C's/bigs in the league, and did so by comparing his rate to other bigs. And, I said I thought the ability to draw fouls and get to the line was an important component of a big man's game, for several reasons (like scoring actual easy points; getting his team into the bonus earlier; getting the opposing rim protector in foul trouble) . I didn't make the numbers up but I did say I thought that was a weakness in his game.

I was basing that on Ayton's career and his season in Portland; not last night's game
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Just a clarification: The FT discussion didn't turn into the Ayton/Przybilla/mid-range discussion. This was a thread about Ayton. I presume that means all things Ayton and not just what any one poster wants it to be. I made a post not directed at anyone observing that Ayton did things that helped a team that didn't show up in stats like being able to switch out on guards or shoot from the mid-range to open up the restricted area for teammates. Someone came in to say Hassan Whiteside had a mid-range game, too. At some point you came in and I guess that's where the FT part of the discussion took over.

But, again, no one, no one is saying Ayton shouldn't get to the line at least a little bit more. The discussion is more about just how important it is for a player to do that, if it really is a thing that on its own significantly diminishes a player's value if he doesn't.
 
Ayton's the second coming of Mychal Thompson.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Serious question, last night Ayton had quite a few dunks.....so many of his shots were at the basket. He also had zero free throw attempts. So was that a negative for those debating the importance of drawing fouls?
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Most of those dunks were off lobs though.
 
robson said:
That's the thing. If you dunk like Shaq, you go to the line. Ayton dunks, but still doesn't touch people. Still soft.
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Interesting take. Are you saying Ayton does not touch people when he dunks........and that is a negative?
 
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