Notice Chauncey Billups new Portland Trail Blazers head coach

[B-Roy]

What evidence that there was no investigation? Got a link? I must have missed it.

Your response basically tells me you did not read the article.

https://www.opb.org/article/2021/07...billups-1997-rape-sexual-assault-allegations/

 

[wizenheimer]

Neil said it was proprietary and that's fine. I wouldn't expect him to share the details of the investigation. Then he said that everyone would have to take his word for it, that the investigation was thorough and the OPB article from Tuesday shows that the investigation was not thorough.

How in the fuck am I asking Neil for his passwords? I'm asking why he lied, told everyone to take his word for it and now you're defending him for some reason? The lie wasn't that the info was proprietary, the lie was that the investigation was thorough and it was compounded by him talking about how some things are bigger than basketball and then putting everything on his word. Why should anyone trust Neil's word ever again?

it was actually high irony that Olshey would sit in front of local media and tell them to just trust what he says is true. That was hilarious at the same time it was a sure sign he was not to be trusted. OPB simply confirmed the slime trail

those media closer to the situation seem to have a consensus opinion that Olshey had determined Billups was going to be the next head coach, probably even well before he announced the firing of Stotts. Everything that happened in the process after that decision, including 'strategic' leaks, appears to have been window dressing. That's actually pretty common. But Olshey just couldn't conceal his hubris and low regard for anybody questioning him. And some of those leaks exposed Dame to a lot of abuse. Shifting blame is Olshey's M.O.

 

[blazerkor]

Hey, if you're right, you have every right to be concerned. But, I practically live on these message boards for the last month, and I have no evidence about OPB doing more than Neil. What'd they do? Did they establish that there is no proof that Billups was even at Walker's house? Because, that would be news. How do you know what Neil did? By his own admission, it was proprietary? Lots are skeptical about Neil, but he did hire someone to look into it? Is he supposed to investigate himself?

OPB asked the DA's office, the former DA, the former and current lawyer of the accuser and none of them had been contacted by anybody in regards to the case/allegations.

I don't think an actual thorough investigation would have turned up anything new or important but that's an assumption and assuming is the opposite of being thorough which is what Olshey promised the investigation was. So you can spin this any way you want but Olshey said something that wasn't true and told everyone they would have to take his word for it. When OPB didn't take Olshey's word for it, they proved Olshey and the team to be at fault. At this point it has nothing to do with Chauncey and if he's a good hire, it's about the hiring process and the illegitimate statements made to the media by Olshey about that process.

 

[B-Roy]

it was actually high irony that Olshey would sit in front of local media and tell them to just trust what he says is true. That was hilarious at the same time it was a sure sign he was not to be trusted. OPB simply confirmed the slime trail

those media closer to the situation seem to have a consensus opinion that Olshey had determined Billups was going to be the next head coach, probably even well before he announced the firing of Stotts. Everything that happened in the process after that decision, including 'strategic' leaks, appears to have been window dressing. That's actually pretty common. But Olshey just couldn't conceal his hubris and low regard for anybody questioning him. And some of those leaks exposed Dame to a lot of abuse. Shifting blame is Olshey's M.O.

There's actually nothing wrong with this, but the shit-storm started when Billups was considered a candidate. He had plenty of time to do an actual investigation (which came to the same conclusion) and figure out a way to convey that information so people wouldn't have shit to scrutinize.

 

[crandc]

The accuser doesn't want to be outed or bothered with this. That's not a shortcoming of the investigation. It's respecting a person's privacy.

Plus the settlement includes an NDA, as they always do.

If some stranger called her up and said hi, I want to talk to you about when you were raped she would absolutely be justified in hanging up the phone, NDA or not.

 

[B-Roy]

OPB asked the DA's office, the former DA, the former and current lawyer of the accuser and none of them had been contacted by anybody in regards to the case/allegations.

I don't think an actual thorough investigation would have turned up anything new or important but that's an assumption and assuming is the opposite of being thorough which is what Olshey promised the investigation was. So you can spin this any way you want but Olshey said something that wasn't true and told everyone they would have to take his word for it. When OPB didn't take Olshey's word for it, they proved Olshey and the team to be at fault. At this point it has nothing to do with Chauncey and if he's a good hire, it's about the hiring process and the illegitimate statements made to the media by Olshey about that process.

Also, who lied to Quick?

A source says the team commissioned a former FBI investigator to retrace the case. Witnesses were re-interviewed. Tapes of past interviews were watched. Billups, in his interviews with the team, was questioned about the particulars. Olshey, however, told the press conference — which was being broadcast live by a Portland television station — that the details of who did the investigation and what they found was “proprietary” information. “You are just going to have to take us at our word that we hired an experienced firm who ran an investigation that gave us the results that we’ve already discussed.”

What tapes? Clearly they didn't get them from the Boston police department, since the article said that the police department did not disclose any information to the guy.

Also, clear as day why Olshey didn't want who was responsible for the investigation to get outed. That "ex-FBI" agent is an absolute circus show for the Portland media. No wonder what they found was "proprietary".

Seriously, how can people defend Olshey? Wonder if the only reason he's not fired yet is because he's still somewhat in the good graces of Dame. We know they talk constantly about the basketball aspect.

 

[blazerkor]

hook me up with a link. If I haven't already read it, I'll read it.

https://www.opb.org/article/2021/07...billups-1997-rape-sexual-assault-allegations/

 

[SlyPokerDog]

OPB asked the DA's office, the former DA, the former and current lawyer of the accuser and none of them had been contacted by anybody in regards to the case/allegations.

I don't think an actual thorough investigation would have turned up anything new or important but that's an assumption and assuming is the opposite of being thorough which is what Olshey promised the investigation was. So you can spin this any way you want but Olshey said something that wasn't true and told everyone they would have to take his word for it. When OPB didn't take Olshey's word for it, they proved Olshey and the team to be at fault. At this point it has nothing to do with Chauncey and if he's a good hire, it's about the hiring process and the illegitimate statements made to the media by Olshey about that process.

Before reading what I'm going to post I want it on the record I have no problem with Billups being our next coach.

I posted something similar right after the press conference. The independent investigation was kinda BS. Vulcan is a multibillion-dollar company. This is a company that hires former Navy Seals as bodyguards and former highly decorated FBI agents for team security. To think that Vulcan couldn't and didn't do a better in-house investigation over this is laughable. The man who did the outside investigation is being paid to be a buffer and/or fall guy if needed.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Your response basically tells me you did not read the article.

https://www.opb.org/article/2021/07...billups-1997-rape-sexual-assault-allegations/

The article does not say that there was no investigation.

 

[B-Roy]

Before reading what I'm going to post I want it on the record I have no problem with Billups being our next coach.

I posted something similar right after the press conference. The independent investigation was kinda BS. Vulcan is a multibillion-dollar company. This is a company that hires former Navy Seals as bodyguards and former highly decorated FBI agents for team security. To think that Vulcan couldn't and didn't do a better in-house investigation over this is laughable. The man who did the outside investigation is being paid to be a buffer and/or fall guy if needed.

I don't want to get into politics but the guy who did the investigation is a right wing tin-foil hat conspiracy dumbass that would get torn to shreds by the media. Of all people, Olshey chose him???? Like, couldn't Olshey see that his credibility would get shot the moment that guy's profile got leaked?

Like you said, Vulcan is a multi billion dollar company. What the fuck was Olshey doing?

 

[B-Roy]

The article does not say that there was no investigation.

It says no one was contacted and no information by any parties that would have known anything were released to the "ex-FBI" agent that did the investigation, which implies no real investigation was done.

This was Quick:

A source says the team commissioned a former FBI investigator to retrace the case. Witnesses were re-interviewed. Tapes of past interviews were watched. Billups, in his interviews with the team, was questioned about the particulars. Olshey, however, told the press conference — which was being broadcast live by a Portland television station — that the details of who did the investigation and what they found was “proprietary” information. “You are just going to have to take us at our word that we hired an experienced firm who ran an investigation that gave us the results that we’ve already discussed.”

How do you re-interview witnesses and watch tapes of past interviews when you don't even contact the witnesses? When you can't get the tapes from the police department? They didn't even contact the DA that is adamantly supporting Billups, of all people!

Just put two and two together.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

OPB asked the DA's office, the former DA, the former and current lawyer of the accuser and none of them had been contacted by anybody in regards to the case/allegations.

I don't think an actual thorough investigation would have turned up anything new or important but that's an assumption and assuming is the opposite of being thorough which is what Olshey promised the investigation was. So you can spin this any way you want but Olshey said something that wasn't true and told everyone they would have to take his word for it. When OPB didn't take Olshey's word for it, they proved Olshey and the team to be at fault. At this point it has nothing to do with Chauncey and if he's a good hire, it's about the hiring process and the illegitimate statements made to the media by Olshey about that process.

It's very possible you're right. But, what I think happened is more likely. Olshey hired a firm to do a "thorough investigation", the firm told Olshey it did a "thorough investigation", and he told the press that a "thorough investigation" was done.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

It says no one was contacted and no information by any parties that would have known anything were released to the "ex-FBI" agent that did the investigation, which implies no real investigation was done.

This was Quick:



How do you re-interview witnesses and watch tapes of past interviews when you don't even contact the witnesses? When you can't get the tapes from the police department? They didn't even contact the DA that is adamantly supporting Billups, of all people!

Just put two and two together.

see my post just above.

 

[wizenheimer]

There's actually nothing wrong with this, but the shit-storm started when Billups was considered a candidate. He had plenty of time to do an actual investigation (which came to the same conclusion) and figure out a way to convey that information so people wouldn't have shit to scrutinize.

sure...that's why I said it's common. Almost every large organization will have a hiring process, and often, the process is just window dressing, dotting i's and crossing t's, so as to award the job to the person it was always going to be awarded to anyway

maybe Billups was the best candidate. I don't know, one way or the other. He certainly had the least coaching experience among several potential candidates. And a lot of those other candidates don't have the personal baggage that Billups does, even if the baggage was vague and 24 years old. This situation could have been avoided with a different choice. Then, like many here are calling for, we could be busy fighting about the actual coaching credentials of the new coach instead of a 24 year old settlement obscured by NDA's, an apparent sham investigation, and the snake oil oozing out of the GM's office

 

[blazerkor]

If some stranger called her up and said hi, I want to talk to you about when you were raped she would absolutely be justified in hanging up the phone, NDA or not.

For sure, so any investigator worth anything would have contacted her lawyer and her lawyer didn't get contacted and seems pretty upset about that. So we just didn't do even close to a good enough investigation, let alone a thorough one.

Now, I assume that an actual thorough investigation would have showed that there was no evidence that would forgo Chauncey's presumption of innocence. So it would have come down to a he said she said from over 20 years ago since Chauncey said he was sticking with his original statement. Given what all of the actual thorough investigations of the reporters have found, I don't think anything we've seen would have been enough to deny Chauncey the opportunity at the job.

The problem is the part where I said assume. The team shouldn't have to assume because Neil said they did a thorough investigation and to take his word for it but they were just assuming because they did not do a thorough investigation. So I know this really doesn't have anything to do with the victim but instead of Chauncey's character being indicted by this process, Olshey's has been.

 

[B-Roy]

It's very possible you're right. But, what I think happened is more likely. Olshey hired a firm to do a "thorough investigation", the firm told Olshey it did a "thorough investigation", and he told the press that a "thorough investigation" was done.

Really? That’s your conclusion? I think that’s about as likely as Olshey admitting he made a wrong draft pick.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Really? That’s your conclusion? I think that’s about as likely as Olshey admitting he made a wrong draft pick.

lol

 

[Natebishop3]

This is starting to play out like a nightmare scenario.

If the team would have simply fired Neil after the season, we could have started fresh and proven to Dame that we were serious about winning. Unfortunately we kept Neil, he completely bungled the way that Billups was hired, and if they fire Neil now we're going to be in an extremely weak position to make any moves this offseason.

This could drastically affect our ability to keep Norm and Dame. Our team looks like it's in complete disarray right now.

 

[blazerkor]

Before reading what I'm going to post I want it on the record I have no problem with Billups being our next coach.

I posted something similar right after the press conference. The independent investigation was kinda BS. Vulcan is a multibillion-dollar company. This is a company that hires former Navy Seals as bodyguards and former highly decorated FBI agents for team security. To think that Vulcan couldn't and didn't do a better in-house investigation over this is laughable. The man who did the outside investigation is being paid to be a buffer and/or fall guy if needed.

I don't think they did a better investigation from in house people because the DA's office, former DA and the attorney of the alleged victim all said that no one contacted them regarding the case/allegation. So to me it looks like negligence all around or that Vulcan trusted Olshey with this and he was the only one who shit the bed... which honestly would be a second layer of insulation. The big problem with all of this is not as much that the investigation wasn't thorough, it is that Olshey asked everyone to take his word for it that it was thorough and that he took it seriously because some things are bigger than basketball.

No matter how you cut it it's a clusterfuck for Olshey.

 

[blazerkor]

It's very possible you're right. But, what I think happened is more likely. Olshey hired a firm to do a "thorough investigation", the firm told Olshey it did a "thorough investigation", and he told the press that a "thorough investigation" was done.

The problem is that when Olshey said that the firm was proprietary information... he then should have said that the firm assured him that they did a thorough investigation. Then that puts the onus back on the firm. Instead Olshey vouched for the investigation being thorough and told everyone, not to take the word of the firm he hired but his own word for it. Olshey made himself culpable if the investigation wasn't thorough. The investigation wasn't and Olshey is most definitely on the hook.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

The problem is that when Olshey said that the firm was proprietary information... he then should have said that the firm assured him that they did a thorough investigation. Then that puts the onus back on the firm. Instead Olshey vouched for the investigation being thorough and told everyone, not to take the word of the firm he hired but his own word for it. Olshey made himself culpable if the investigation wasn't thorough. The investigation wasn't and Olshey is most definitely on the hook.

agreed 100%.
He shouldn't have thrown Stotts under the bus.
He should have put the onus on firm he hired.
He shouldn't have said "trust us"
He shouldn't have said that we were going to run it back (pissing Dame off).
However, I do think Billups is a great pickup, and it will pay dividends.

Neil is usually very professional. He is rattled this offseason. Hopefully, he gets back on track in actual basketball-related matters. The first one (hiring Billups) was great.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Neil now we're going to be in an extremely weak position to make any moves this offseason.

Not if they hire me to be GM. The other 29 GMs have never had to deal with a dog before. I would crush them!

 

[blazerkor]

agreed 100%.
He shouldn't have thrown Stotts under the bus.
He should have put the onus on firm he hired.
He shouldn't have said "trust us"
He shouldn't have said that we were going to run it back (pissing Dame off).
However, I do think Billups is a great pickup, and it will pay dividends.

Neil is usually very professional. He is rattled this offseason. Hopefully, he gets back on track in actual basketball-related matters. The first one (hiring Billups) was great.

I like the Billups hire and I want Neil out now. I actually think it's going to happen this time. You don't get to fuck up all of the things you just listed, nail the one other thing you listed and skate. That's the way it can work with some things but right now he's created a PR nightmare for the team but it's actually not a nightmare if they fire him because he's put it all on himself.

 

[Strenuus]

Just get rid of Neil. Please. Its been 5 years too long.

 

[Natebishop3]

Just get rid of Neil. Please. Its been 5 years too long.

Do you think firing Neil at this point would be a good idea? We're so close to the draft and free agency. There's no way they could hire a replacement quickly. Also, what would happen to Billups? They fire Neil and keep Billups?

 

[Mr. Robot]

Just get rid of Neil. Please. Its been 5 years too long.

there are other reasons for him to get fired, but this isnt one of them

id keep him in spite of the imbeciles that wont let this thing go, just let them know that street cant run the franchise... fuck them

 

[THE HCP]

I predict a great off-season for Olshey. He's a really good GM with some obvious flaws. Getting Billups was an A+ move.

I don’t understand. Great off season, how? He’s done right?
The talent on the team wasn’t the problem, the COACHING was right?
I’m confused.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Do you think firing Neil at this point would be a good idea? We're so close to the draft and free agency. There's no way they could hire a replacement quickly. Also, what would happen to Billups? They fire Neil and keep Billups?

Billups did nothing wrong during the hiring process and there is no reason to fire him.

 

[THE HCP]

he probably shouldn’t have, but at least it was a separate thread with a clear title that I could easily choose not to click on. I don’t wanna open this specific thread and see people going in circles.

You mean like for the past 2 years, regardless of thread topic……be it about NASA, the playoff race or Trump, all you’d get was the same 10 people screaming #FireStotts.
Ya, that would suck.

 

[illmatic99]

Do you think firing Neil at this point would be a good idea? We're so close to the draft and free agency. There's no way they could hire a replacement quickly. Also, what would happen to Billups? They fire Neil and keep Billups?

unless he has deals lined up and has tampered with agents, etc, i don't see how it could hurt. I'm under the impression we will do nothing significant in the draft anyway.