Dame asks for trade (And there it is) (1 Viewer)

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BLAZINGGIANTS said:
Agreed that Joe is a ball-less hack who is going to cave and settle for pennies on the dollar, which means Dame is most likely going to get his wish of Miami.

But that doesn’t change my stance that we owe Dame nothing other than the financial obligations of his contract while he is a Blazer.
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I think there is a chance he will be on the team when season starts. I would hope for Dames sake & ours that something sooner happens, but with 4 years left and a guy that just had his best year ever, top 75 all timer, the org needs to maximize their return for him. I think they will come up with an amicable agreement that will send Dame to Miami once a respectable deal is offered. Riley is going to play a low ball, game make him go to work for a compelling offer. If Dame only had a year left, then get something done quickly.
 
BLAZINGGIANTS said:
Agreed that Joe is a ball-less hack who is going to cave and settle for pennies on the dollar, which means Dame is most likely going to get his wish of Miami.

But that doesn’t change my stance that we owe Dame nothing other than the financial obligations of his contract while he is a Blazer.
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I think sending him to Boston would satisfy everyone's needs.
 
Hoopguru said:
I think there is a chance he will be on the team when season starts. I would hope for Dames sake & ours that something sooner happens, but with 4 years left and a guy that just had his best year ever, top 75 all timer, the org needs to maximize their return for him. I think they will come up with an amicable agreement that will send Dame to Miami once a respectable deal is offered. Riley is going to play a low ball, game make him go to work for a compelling offer. If Dame only had a year left, then get something done quickly.
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agreed on all fronts, tho I won’t be surprised to see Joe move quickly to do something with Dame (but also won’t be shocked if he’s here in training camp). He probably feels like he can’t do anything else until this is resolved. I mean, what happened to the FA center we were signing? Crickets. Only thing involving Portland right now involves Dame.
 
BLAZINGGIANTS said:
i woulda taken him on our roster. We need bigger players than SF’s (and guards) but I like his game.
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There's "not being major players in free agency" and then whatever the hell we're doing...

Washington would've been a nice youngish piece to add to a rebuilding roster. Given the lack of rumors connecting us to any player of any significance, I wonder if we're not basically sitting FA out and/or wanting to keep the MLE for trade flexibility... Very odd.
 
glazeduck said:
There's "not being major players in free agency" and then whatever the hell we're doing...

Washington would've been a nice youngish piece to add to a rebuilding roster. Given the lack of rumors connecting us to any player of any significance, I wonder if we're not basically sitting FA out and/or wanting to keep the MLE for trade flexibility... Very odd.
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you can’t spell Jhoe without the “ho”.

this guy is literally the worst GM, other than the guy he replaced/trained under.
 
Natebishop3 said:
But that’s part of why we did the CJ deal. It wasn’t a coincidence that we got just the right size TPE and a pick to trade Detroit
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yeah...it's actually possible that a trade is part of a larger strategy. A GM, even a GM like Cronin, might be able to plan ahead further than the current move on the board.
 
BLAZINGGIANTS said:
you can’t spell Jhoe without the “ho”.

this guy is literally the worst GM, other than the guy he replaced/trained under.
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It's a little hard to say that so definitively without knowing the overall plan. I think that's what most of us are hoping to see -- signs of an overall plan, of confident leadership, of competent management of the franchise.

He's been hit/miss in trades but has been pretty stellar with the draft and he built a crazy great personnel staff, so it hasn't all been bad. All of that (and free agency) is small potatoes compared to how he handles this Dame situation, and I've seen nothing to suggest that he's failing it so far. Long way of saying, if we're being fair and reasonable, I think it's more like the jury's still out (but currently leaning towards guilty)...
 
glazeduck said:
It's a little hard to say that so definitively without knowing the overall plan. I think that's what most of us are hoping to see -- signs of an overall plan, of confident leadership, of competent management of the franchise.

He's been hit/miss in trades but has been pretty stellar with the draft and he built a crazy great personnel staff, so it hasn't all been bad. All of that (and free agency) is small potatoes compared to how he handles this Dame situation, and I've seen nothing to suggest that he's failing it so far. Long way of saying, if we're being fair and reasonable, I think it's more like the jury's still out (but currently leaning towards guilty)...
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He (or his people) recognize talent in the draft. Solid there. His trades have been questionable at best. You have to maximize value in trades and I question what he’s accomplished there thus far, though he was given a weak hand.
 
It seems like it's been an overheated rhetoric around your history of if you think Cronin's a legit hire or not, but just in looking at the trades/trade demands I don't know that I get the hype or lack thereof...

If there had been a trade completed, it seems like (from national accounts, not just Cronin and POR) that it would've massively sucked. Not to rehash, but even the "all our picks and Simons and filler for Zion", if it had gone through, would've not made me a stoked fan. And the other pieces (yes, Masai, please send us your good players so we can get better) didn't seem to work out. They were able to get Grant last year, and if for some reason we still had RoCo and Powell we would've received waaaay less than last year's return.

GP2 didn't want to be here. Hart's the one miss I'd like to have back (I would've loved it to be Ant instead of Hart going to NYC) , but even then I could see the trade as removing risk from him opting out and losing him for nothing. We got a Murray Twin instead.

I admit that I haven't been tied in as much in the last year or two, but were there deals we know were left on the table and unconsummated because Cronin got scared to pull the trigger? It seems as if he's been pretty prescient on value of players around the league and getting out early to preserve his plan, which I can't really fault.
 
I'm going to be a Cronin apologist and say, Cronin already won the trade for Dame.

The guy with no ballsack traded Dame for Scoot Henderson and Kris Murray. (The 43rd pick wouldn't have got anything to please Dame).

For me, that's a home run.

Yes, I will be very angry if Cronin gets a seemingly terrible return in a trade with another team for Dame. Seemingly means if it's a rookie or 2nd year player like Wendell Carter Jr. we won't know for a few years. Certainly we won't know if a draft pick will turn into Franz Wagner. But, the "win now" days with guys like Robert Covington and Norman Powell are over. A couple years from now is just fine.
In any case, no GM is perfect and I'll give Joe at least a few years before making a general judgement.
So far, he's been lucky as hell. Luck is HUGE in the NBA. Look at how Golden State built their championship core. Or, where Jokic was picked in the draft.
 
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AmirIcon said:
There's not much to hold out for with Miami. We're getting back role players and late 1st round talent. I'm sure they'll be good but I'd much rather be looking at a lotto team for bringing back talent.
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Why even follow it if you already know the deal.

Next time make sure they have you sign an NDA since you know everything already.
 
Strenuus said:
Why even follow it if you already know the deal.

Next time make sure they have you sign an NDA since you know everything already.
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I'm not really. I already know we're going to get a bunch of role players and late picks. My only asks are Caleb Martin and Noah Clowney. I know we'll get Jovic and Jaques.
 
AmirIcon said:
I'm not really. I already know we're going to get a bunch of role players and late picks. My only asks are Caleb Martin and Noah Clowney. I know we'll get Jovic and Jaques.
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I think for a trade to be successful, the Blazers should get back a high-level role player who plays defense, and draft picks. It'll take time (probably a few seasons) to find out what we got in the whole package.
 
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AmirIcon said:
I'm not really. I already know we're going to get a bunch of role players and late picks. My only asks are Caleb Martin and Noah Clowney. I know we'll get Jovic and Jaques.
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So why follow it? You already know.

Have you realized it yet? No?
 
blazerfan11 said:
I'm going to be a Cronin apologist and say, Cronin already won the trade for Dame.

The guy with no ballsack traded Dame for Scoot Henderson and Kris Murray. (The 43rd pick wouldn't have got anything to please Dame).

For me, that's a home run.
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It’s funny to me that people call Cronin spineless because he really looked Dame in the eye and told him through his actions: “I’m drafting a point guard, I’m not trading him… you want in or out?”

Dame wanted out. That’s fine. It’s also the move ownership and Cronin probably wanted. The team can’t mortgage its future for Dame. Both in that they shouldn’t and that they lacked the resources to do it correctly.

Dame isn’t objective in his assessment of players; his ideas to get players were much more about bringing in guys he wanted to play with, not the best players we could get and certainly not the best players for the team.

Cronin didn’t cave in to Dame, which has to be one of the ballsiest moves possible, smart or not (people here gotta remember balls are not brains, and sometimes they make the brains worse lol).
 
Strenuus said:
Im just laughing at this point. its really funny to me.
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Yeah you seem like a That 70's Show kinda guy.

Mike Ritchman and Marc Spears have reported today that Dame is going to Miami. If I'm wrong, you can m say I told you so.

But until then... FOLLOW ME.
 
AmirIcon said:
Yeah you seem like a That 70's Show kinda guy.

Mike Ritchman and Marc Spears have reported today that Dame is going to Miami. If I'm wrong, you can m say I told you so.

But until then... FOLLOW ME.
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This idea that “going to Miami” means we lose is asinine. You can send Dame to Miami and also get back what you want. If multiple teams are involved the fact that Dame ends up in Miami is nearly meaningless; all that matters is what we get back.
 
I think the Blazers are in an industry that isn't unlike any other in that it's segmented. Not only by market size but product produced.
Not every team can be a high end market, Lexus, Acura, but the majority of teams every year are more like Chevrolet, Ford, Kia, mid markets, and like every other market segment there is the laggard segment.
Good, Better, Best
 
Everything Beagle said:
This idea that “going to Miami” means we lose is asinine. You can send Dame to Miami and also get back what you want. If multiple teams are involved the fact that Dame ends up in Miami is nearly meaningless; all that matters is what we get back.
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Yep.
 
AmirIcon said:
Yeah you seem like a That 70's Show kinda guy.

Mike Ritchman and Marc Spears have reported today that Dame is going to Miami. If I'm wrong, you can m say I told you so.

But until then... FOLLOW ME.
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Is the deal finished? Has it been reported?
 
Everything Beagle said:
It’s funny to me that people call Cronin spineless because he really looked Dame in the eye and told him through his actions: “I’m drafting a point guard, I’m not trading him… you want in or out?”

Dame wanted out. That’s fine. It’s also the move ownership and Cronin probably wanted. The team can’t mortgage its future for Dame. Both in that they shouldn’t and that they lacked the resources to do it correctly.

Dame isn’t objective in his assessment of players; his ideas to get players were much more about bringing in guys he wanted to play with, not the best players we could get and certainly not the best players for the team.

Cronin didn’t cave in to Dame, which has to be one of the ballsiest moves possible, smart or not (people here gotta remember balls are not brains, and sometimes they make the brains worse lol).
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"Dame isn’t objective in his assessment of players; his ideas to get players were much more about bringing in guys he wanted to play with, not the best players we could get and certainly not the best players for the team."

It feels like he didn't at all evaluate what the Blazers got in the draft. A PG who does what Dame doesn't do, a 22-year old forward, and a young guy who will be happy just playing defense.
 
Hoopguru said:
I think the Blazers are in an industry that isn't unlike any other in that it's segmented. Not only by market size but product produced.
Not every team can be a high end market, Lexus, Acura, but the majority of teams every year are more like Chevrolet, Ford, Kia, mid markets, and like every other market segment there is the laggard segment.
Good, Better, Best
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we are definitely in a Good market segment and while we want that Best product, the fact is that both teams that went to the finals were Better products that overperformed (which is fantastic!) and that’s what we should be aiming for right now. Best assets won’t come here willingly. But we can draft them; we’ve proven that. So draft and build, when the players you drafted don’t work out, move them out. That’s our process.
 
blazerfan11 said:
"Dame isn’t objective in his assessment of players; his ideas to get players were much more about bringing in guys he wanted to play with, not the best players we could get and certainly not the best players for the team."

It feels like he didn't at all evaluate what the Blazers got in the draft. A PG who does what Dame doesn't do, a 22-year old forward, and a young guy who will be happy just playing defense.
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It also seems that it's dawned on people that Scoot is closer to 6' 4" in shoes than 6 ' 2".
Hoopguru said:
I think the Blazers are in an industry that isn't unlike any other in that it's segmented. Not only by market size but product produced.
Not every team can be a high end market, Lexus, Acura, but the majority of teams every year are more like Chevrolet, Ford, Kia, mid markets, and like every other market segment there is the laggard segment.
Good, Better, Best
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How "high end" you are depends on your roster and wins and losses, not where your team is located. NY for many years was a dumpster only New Yorkers watched, while San Antonio was the Lexus.
 
glazeduck said:
Yeah the latest report I can find on Twitter is the "Blazers aren't impressed with the Heat's offer" bit...

Not seeing anything from Richman today.

Biases be damned, it seems silly and disingenuous to critique a trade that hasn't happened yet...
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Richman posts his pods the night before.
 
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