Politics Iowa Democratic caucus results are plunged into crisis as party says it has found 'INCONSISTENCIES'
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andalusian
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In theory, if properly implemented, it should be very very hard to hack. The issues are as always in implementation - and because this shit is not regulated - it's the wild wild west out there - with everyone under the sun implementing their own freaking code - it is not a surprise that it is being hacked now.
VanillaGorilla
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He didn't say it was unhackable.
jonnyboy
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A coin toss is bad enough, but wow. I’m totally speechless. We live in clown world.
They got the guy who’s never seen a coin before to do the coin toss. He flipped it, kind of, and then proceeded to turn it over by hand a couple more times while looking directly at it, as per the instructions of his handlers standing around him.
Any 3rd grader worth their marbles would’ve called bullshit. Unfortunately, there were no 3rd graders available to oversee this process.
They got the guy who’s never seen a coin before to do the coin toss. He flipped it, kind of, and then proceeded to turn it over by hand a couple more times while looking directly at it, as per the instructions of his handlers standing around him.
Any 3rd grader worth their marbles would’ve called bullshit. Unfortunately, there were no 3rd graders available to oversee this process.
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TorturedBlazerFan
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There will always be hackers who are just as smart as non-hackers in SW and I think turning towards electronics and saying that’ll solve it, is just a hipstery thing to say not a real plan, because even if AI coded the system, someone else will develop AI to try to hack it and they’ll eventually succeed. Im all for technology, but saying blockchain and 2fa, and buzzwords and then saying he understands tech are salesmen ploys more than a true understanding of it.
Tech isnt going to save us from stupid.
TorturedBlazerFan
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Well indirectly he did, he said having a president who understands tech means this stuff wont happen. Then he threw out the blockchain term which is an incredible technology dont get me wrong, but tech always comes with its fair share of problems too. He’s essentially saying he’ll understand tech so this stuff wont happen, ok if thats so legit how come so many tech companies and people who understand tech get hacked, and ddos attacks, and have security issues of their own, I dont think Yang or me or any of us understanding tech will keep hackers, scammers, people who want to do bad stuff with technology from doing it.
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This is the 'charm' of the Iowa caucus. You don't find it charming?
Neither do I.
barfo
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This whole thing seems like Bernie was winning, lets fix that up. Oh crap we pressed the wrong button.
Shaboid
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jonnyboy
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I think they pressed the exact button they meant to. The “oh shit, Bernie’s gonna win, ABORT! ABORT!” button.
Now they all throw their hands up and act confused. Russia is about due to get accused of tampering, let the countdown begin.
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Not really. Bernie is pretty much the reason there is a caucus instead of a primary in the first place, the DNC was ready to go primary after last time, but part of the payback to Bernie for 2016 was 'improving' rather than replacing the caucuses, because Bernie does better in caucuses.
Last night was likely incompetence, not conspiracy.
barfo
TorturedBlazerFan
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I'm not even slightly invested in seeing Bernie win, but honestly, if I was a Bernie supporter and they come out and show someone else winning I'd be very frustrated. It seems obvious he has the backing of enough people to win, but the DNC really, really doesn't want that to happen. Now maybe they'll come out and he'll be on top who knows.
TorturedBlazerFan
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Neither of us can really prove that one way or the other it's just confirmation bias for both of us that says what's more likely.
Hoopguru
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To me its just another downfall of the two party system and their National Committees, which are nothing more than a group of political appointees that are supposed to run things and manage a process with efficiency. They are not exempt from bad management just like any company and/or organization. When there are really only two main parties/committees and no competition to speak of it hinders their abilities to innovate and be very efficient. This is what happens with capitalism, the competition and consumers set the standards and expectations for innovation, superb products and/or services.
The DNC & RNC would be laggards if they had to compete & Innovate. Look at the product they are producing now?
andalusian
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This is not what I am saying. What I am saying is that if the cryptographic chains are properly implemented and there is regulation to ensures that these things are not deployed willy nilly - it is going to be very hard to crack it.
I have been dealing with security in financial systems for a while now - and there are always places where there is exposure that makes it vulnerable - but the article that was linked to was an example of people not keeping up with advances in cryptology and crypto-implementations - it is not an inherent fault in block-chain.
The advantages of a block-chain where there is a complete transaction-ledger with each transaction are obvious if you can trust the implementation of this ledger - over the distributed transactions we have in traditional finances. I can assure you that if traditional finances were not regulated - you will see an awful lot more hacks.
andalusian
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It does? It was obvious that Hillary had the votes to win against Trump - and she did not. That's why there are elections and counts. It is not obvious to me at all that they have the support - they might just have a lot more loud supporters. I honestly do not know.
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Incompetence is a *lot* more prevalent than conspiracy. If you are guessing (which we are) incompetence is a better guess.
barfo
TorturedBlazerFan
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Well of course, but my argument wasn't the implementation of blockchain vs any other sort of security implementation. My point is that there will always be breaches and that even a very well designed implementation can and will be breached at some point. The article I linked wasn't well thought out, it was just a quick google search on blockchains being hacked, yes we can blame the implementation and that is part of the problem, but I don't believe that any implementation is unhackable, or that in this case Yang, Google, apple or you and I will create a world where "problems like this don't happen". Of course, w/o well thought out regulations and processes there would be more hacks.
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how is that obvious? From everything I saw last night, Pete and Bernie both are plausible narrow winners.
barfo
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How would you go about quantifying that to prove your case?
andalusian
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I agree that there are no absolutes. But - blockchain has a place - and once it is properly regulated - it will be an advancement in financial systems security - and not a trivial one. The issue now is 100% that we are in the wild wild west days there.
TorturedBlazerFan
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Well, what's obvious to you and to me may differ, but to me, it seems like Bernie has a lot of support but every time it appears like he's going to win the DNC says not today.
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Same way I'd go about proving to you that most senior citizens can't run as fast as Usain Bolt.
If your observations of the human condition lead you to believe that there are more conspiracies than incompetence. well, then you may be a conspiracy theorist.
barfo
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I'd agree with this. I would say from my (shorter than yours) experience in the world of software that there is a problem in general with regulation, procedures, guidelines and best practices for the development and engineering of software. I'm sure this goes into security as well, the issue I see with security SW though is that there seems to be a cat and mouse thing with well just call them "hackers" even though not all security breaches are "hacks", where there are two very smart groups constantly one-upping each other, blockchain does it's placed and like I said I think the platform of "let's understand tech", even has a place. I just took issue with the notion that somehow understanding it means problems won't happen, we may find "less" problems, we might just find a new set of problems I don't know, but I don't believe tech = problems won't happen, which is how Yang's tweet read to me.
Hoopguru
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Last election the DNC had a preference and a plan that we all learned about.
Im sure the DNC has a preference this year too.
The RNC had a plan for 2016 primaries and it wasn't Trump.
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Uhm, every time? You think he had more support in 2016 than Hillary? How do you explain that she got millions more votes?
Oh, right, conspiracy.
When the results come out, if he didn't win Iowa outright, he likely came close, and beat most of the supposed DNC favorites. But yeah, conspiracy against Bernie!
He's likely to win NH. When he wins, will it be a conspiracy against him? Maybe he should have gotten ALL of the votes instead of just a plurality?
barfo
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That isn't really an argument.
My observation of the human condition isn't really all that important in this case as my observation is that incompetence and conspiring to get what we want is a common trait of humans, but I can't prove it, our observations
while they do play a part in providing evidence are just anecdotal.
You can prove Usain Bolt can run faster than the average anyone simply with a radar gun and factual evidence.
TorturedBlazerFan
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Hey look I see a man made of straw.
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BREAKING NEWS: Democrats will publish HALF of the Iowa caucus results by 5pm - but crisis could last for weeks leaving state with NO official winner
- Pete Buttigieg, the former South Bend mayor, declared himself victor of the Iowa caucus even though there are no official results
- He said Tuesday in New Hampshire his performance had been 'phenomenal'
- Elizabeth Warren said she feels 'good' but results are still too close
- Amy Klobuchar said she did 'incredibly well'
- 'We don't know all of the results. But we do know that by the time it's all said and done, Iowa: you have shocked the nation,' Because by all indications we are going on to New Hampshire victorious,' Buttigieg said in Iowa Monday
- But the entire Democratic field have no idea of official results after the Iowa Democratic Party's reporting app crashed and its backup phone system did too
- Joe Biden rolled out endorsement of Caroline Kennedy, JFK's daughter
- Buttigieg's daring move came as party issued panicked statement saying it had not been hacked but results had 'inconsistencies' and paper ballots will be used