...O/T...I am so sick of this type thing;

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...OK stupid, let dummy it down for you for about the 8th time did he or did he not say "...black people were happy picking cotton,drinking from seperate water fountains, sitting in the back of buses & getting there food from the rear entrances of restaurants."


...the answer is no...hence, you are a liar.




...merry xmas.
 
...OK stupid, let dummy it down for you for about the 8th time did he or did he not say "...black people were happy picking cotton,drinking from seperate water fountains, sitting in the back of buses & getting there food from the rear entrances of restaurants."


...the answer is no...hence, you are a liar.




...merry xmas.

Did he say "Pre-entitlement, pre-welfare" or not?

He did. You're simply wrong.
 
Sorry, to answer twice, but I had two answers :)

My experience is clearly different than yours. I grew up in Chicago, which was very segregated. The south side was mostly black people and the north side was mostly white people. It was segregated more than by black/white, too. There were lots of ethnic neighborhoods - irish, polish, puerto rican, and so on.

The black/white issue was just terrible for the black folk. There was a mass migration from the south (Jim Crow, the racism, the threat to their lives and livelihood) to Chicago. Mayor Richard J. Daley was a terrible racist. He took federal money and built these nice new low-income apartment buildings called Cabrini Green and targeted the black folk to move in. And they did, because the banks wouldn't lend them money to buy houses and so on. Once they moved in, he built freeways around the project to keep the black folk in, to keep make it difficult for them to establish business, etc. Then he let the place crumble to some of the worst conditions imaginable. Elevators didn't work so a mother would have to carry groceries up five flights or more of stairs and that sort of thing.

I grew up on the south side, and what I saw was white flight. The more black people moved in, the more white people moved out. They took their wealth with them. The banks wouldn't lend to the black people to buy and fix up the homes. A lot of the homes there were Frank Lloyd Wright designs. Seriously wonderful architecture that all went to shit.

50 years ago, you say, would be 1963.

Well, in 1983 (that would be 30 years ago), Harold Washington ran for mayor of Chicago.

Washington wasn't allowed to attend the college of his choice. He went to Roosevelt College which was where black and jewish people were allowed to attend. He did so well that Northwestern University Law School accepted him - he was the only black student in his class. He excelled. He graduated with a law degree (JD) in 1952. Sure, that was before 1983 or 1963, but bear with me.

He went on to work in Chicago City and Illinois State government from 1951 to 1983.

So he runs for Mayor against Jane Byrne and Richard Daley Jr. (the long time mayor's son). They basically split the vote in the primaries, something like 33% to 32% to 32% and Washington won. Realize 2/3 of the people in this "liberal democratic" city voted against him. Then came the mayoral election when he ran against some cannon fodder republican opponent, Bernard Epton. In a city where no republican won the mayor's seat since the 1920s if not earlier, and democrats won election with 80% or more of the vote, it was a 51%-49% election with Washington winning.

That's racism at play. I seriously don't think that passing some laws in 1963 eliminated racism. In 1983, it sure looks to me like black people still needed to overcome a lot of racism.

As mayor, Washington pissed off a lot of people. He started construction on all three major freeways in the city at once, giving the work to black owned contracting firms. Of course, the white owned contracting firms were livid, and the residents were too, since freeway construction meant traffic jams. If anything, he did the right thing by enabling black enterprise (no affirmative action/quotas, just give people jobs). He was in just too much of a hurry.

So now your 50 years looks like 30 years, and even so, the contracting jobs are just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to entrenched favoritism given to white people.

30 years isn't when it all ended, either. The Chicago Police department got sued and lost $25M in a case where policemen were busted for hassling innocent black men, taking them into abandoned buildings and beating them with hoses or burning them on radiators. Torture.

In 1995, the city fire department bypassed 6,000 black would-be firefighters through discriminatory handling of the entrance exam; the city lost a ~$80M lawsuit on their behalf.

I don't see how one can really accept that 50 years ago it was all settled.

You live in NYC? Don't they routinely stop and search black men looking for guns? Or at least they did until the courts stepped in and rightly pointed out it was a violation of their civil and constitutional rights? That's not 50 years ago, that was this year.

What about black on black crime. Serious stuff. It's a real problem, of course. But it's also the result of other problems. If everything was fixed in 1963, we wouldn't even be talking about this sort of thing.

Oh yeah, the south side of chicago is now beautiful. It seems a bunch of black folk pooled their money and bought out the neighborhood bank. Then the bank started giving out loans and those wonderful Frank Lloyd Wright homes got all fixed up, the cars on blocks out front removed, etc. The south side had such a revival that white people moved back.

Denny for starters I never said the problems were fixed 50 years ago. My apologies if you got that impression. I was merely pointing out that things are MUCH different now then they were 50 years ago. Sorry to hear about the 1983 problems in Chicago, apparently we're a few steps ahead here in NY.

You mention the discrimination on the fire fighters tests and people here in NY were up in arms about that because & this is not a direct quote. "The test catered to white people". Seriously? what the hell does that even mean. Does the fire dept have to lower there standards & testing just so everyone can get in. A black man & a white man both go to public school & both go to a city college. We both have the same opportunity to study for the test. I pass, you fail. Because its to white. BULLSHIT!

Then you mention the stop & frisk in Ny. I agree that it could have been handled more professionally & with more respect BUT.........I read a recent article that said said approx 78% of the prison population was black & Hispanic. so why would the police consentrate more on whites & Asians. It's really simple math. And thank you for pointing out the black on black crime. Its even much more prevalent then black & white crime.

Look I know that before we need to know where we're going we need to know where we've been. That's just keeping with history. But many times also it can benefit us to look ahead & stop looking back. Because sometimes the past can help us when other times it can hurt.


And as far as your goose & gander analogy saying that the truth hurts. You're comparing Years of bullshit by Al Sharpton to a one time interview from a reality tv star. Please don't tell me you're doing this. because I'll be very disappointed.
 
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I have purposely stayed away from this because I have been following this thread from the beginning. For what it is worth, Denny your position on this subject, although argued passionately, falls very short when you consider the original statements of this thread. 59, Rick and Hammer have been consistent throughout, when cornered, instead of conceding the point, you go into spin cycle mode to try to re-establish your footing. And just like the character on the show your character starred, you to are to full of yourself. You lost and refuse to accept it. Are any of us here racist, bigots, etc, who knows? However, Robertson may regret saying what he said, he may not. But Corporate America has accepted it and Duck Dynasty is what it is. Now I suspect the show will open with the disclaimer we all know. " The views of the cast may not be the views, you get the point, I hope. YOU LOSE!
 
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I have purposely stayed away from this because I have been following this thread from the beginning. For what it is worth, Denny your position on this subject, although argued passionately, falls very short when you consider the original statements of this thread. 59, Rick and Hammer have been consistent throughout, when cornered, instead of conceding the point, you go into spin cycle mode to try to re-establish your footing. And just like the character on the show your character starred, you to are to full of yourself. You lost and refuse to accept it. Are any of us here racist, bigots, etc, who knows? However, Robertson may regret saying what he said, he may not. But Corporate America has accepted it and Duck Dynasty is what it is. Now I suspect the show will open with the disclaimer we all know. " The views of the cast may not be the views, you get the point, I hope. YOU LOSE!


Frank did you see my response to you in the other thread (baseball related) titled "How many others agree with this"?
 
Denny for starters I never said the problems were fixed 50 years ago. My apologies if you got that impression. I was merely pointing out that things are MUCH different now then they were 50 years ago. Sorry to hear about the 1983 problems in Chicago, apparently we're a few steps ahead here in NY.

You mention the discrimination on the fire fighters tests and people here in NY were up in arms about that because & this is not a direct quote. "The test catered to white people". Seriously? what the hell does that even mean. Does the fire dept have to lower there standards & testing just so everyone can get in. A black man & a white man both go to public school & both go to a city college. We both have the same opportunity to study for the test. I pass, you fail. Because its to white. BULLSHIT!

Then you mention the stop & frisk in Ny. I agree that it could have been handled more professionally & with more respect BUT.........I read a recent article that said said approx 78% of the prison population was black & Hispanic. so why would the police consentrate more on whites & Asians. It's really simple math. And thank you for pointing out the black on black crime. Its even much more prevalent then black & white crime.

Look I know that before we need to know where we're going we need to know where we've been. That's just keeping with history. But many times also it can benefit us to look ahead & stop looking back. Because sometimes the past can help us when other times it can hurt.


And as far as your goose & gander analogy saying that the truth hurts. You're comparing Years of bullshit by Al Sharpton to a one time interview from a reality tv star. Please don't tell me you're doing this. because I'll be very disappointed.

The schools are not equal. Again, what I saw in Chicago was very nice schools in white neighborhoods, and schools that looked like prisons, all run down, bars on the windows, windows boarded up even, in the poorer neighborhoods. The government is used to direct money away from the schools that need the help the most, for obvious reasos.

My goose and gander statement was you talking about house divided and all that. I ask you what about the divisive comments about homosexuals; it's "us" vs. "them (sinners)" according to this guy's gospel.

The prison population? It's mostly drug related offenses, and black people get sent to prison while white people get off. I think you didn't mean to bring that up :)
 
The schools are not equal. Again, what I saw in Chicago was very nice schools in white neighborhoods, and schools that looked like prisons, all run down, bars on the windows, windows boarded up even, in the poorer neighborhoods. The government is used to direct money away from the schools that need the help the most, for obvious reasos.

My goose and gander statement was you talking about house divided and all that. I ask you what about the divisive comments about homosexuals; it's "us" vs. "them (sinners)" according to this guy's gospel.

The prison population? It's mostly drug related offenses, and black people get sent to prison while white people get off. I think you didn't mean to bring that up :)

Yeah I did mean to go there because its fact and your response though not surprising is very disappointing. You really had to go there? "Black people get sent to prison while white people get off". There we have it. You had to pull the race card yourself Denny. Yeah the blacks get blamed for everything by the mighty white man. Holy shit, well this certainly explains your passion in this thread & your defense of Sharpton.

I was just about to post how great it was debating with you until I saw your extremely ignorant response. And you have the balls to verbally crucify Robertson. Congratulations you just took a very healthy debate into the sewer.
 
Yeah I did mean to go there because its fact and your response though not surprising is very disappointing. You really had to go there? "Black people get sent to prison while white people get off". There we have it. You had to pull the race card yourself Denny. Yeah the blacks get blamed for everything by the mighty white man. Holy shit, well this certainly explains your passion in this thread & your defense of Sharpton.

I was just about to post how great it was debating with you until I saw your extremely ignorant response. And you have the balls to verbally crucify Robertson. Congratulations you just took a very healthy debate into the sewer.

My bad. I guess white people don't do or sell drugs.

/sarcasm.

http://www.naacp.org/pages/criminal-justice-fact-sheet

Crime/drug arrest rates: African Americans represent 12% of monthly drug users, but comprise 32% of persons arrested for drug possession
 
Picture this...... here and NOW..... not 50 or 60 years ago.

Prominent famous African Americans....or just common folk speaking out against particular insults, injustices, mistreatment and crimes committed against plain old white americans by non white people or the "system".

Think about it....tic tock tic tock tic tock

I know, I know,
....maybe Denny hasn't been "educated" or prepared for this kind of intellectual honesty.


lmao
 
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He most clearly identified things that began to turn the tide for black people.

He most clearly lumped homosexuality and bestiality together, though the Bible does not. It was a rant. He was whining about "sins" becoming "fine." It was a rant. The link between homosexuality and bestiality was fully his own.

But it was not an unsolicited rant it was a RESPONSE. As far as his linking Homosexuality to bestiality IMO he was just equating animals procreating from behind so in that sense he's really not wrong. I'm not saying its a bad thing but its also not exactly inaccurate.

BINGO Rick... it was a response, not a rant!

And Denny, bestiality and homosexuality are both sins, the bible says that... prove me wrong on that... Both are wrong, both are sins, he just vocalized it... Part of what Phil said was from Corinthians, but not all of it, nor did he claim that it all was. He did NOTHING wrong...
 
BINGO Rick... it was a response, not a rant!

And Denny, bestiality and homosexuality are both sins, the bible says that... prove me wrong on that... Both are wrong, both are sins, he just vocalized it... Part of what Phil said was from Corinthians, but not all of it, nor did he claim that it all was. He did NOTHING wrong...

If he did nothing wrong, nobody would be upset.

:crazy:
 
Sure he was asked questions. His answers proved him a bigot and racist. George W Bush was asked similar questions, and is an evangelist Christian, but never showed anything close to the contempt and disrespect that Robertson did.

Not IMO, he went on a rant and absolutely linked bestiality and homosexuality in a list of "sins" from a tiny excerpt of the New Testament. In the president of A&E's opinion.

The "procreating from behind" thing is rather silly on your part.

Phil showed no contempt. Phil showed no disrespect and you have failed COMPLETELY to show how he has. He said things were wrong.

And he listed it as a sin, but did not claim everything he said was from that passage.
 
It sure seems like many tens of thousands of people write on the WWW about how offensive his speech was. It's not just me who sees it. It's plain as the nose on your face.
 
Unfortunately Denny there are also those people who complain just for the sake of complaining because its the only way to get attention. I refer to the Al Sharpton's of the world.

And Jesse Jackson and Oprah and all the other race-baiters
 
Sharpton is a clown, but he's also done a lot for civil rights for black people. Getting attention is part of what's needed.

BigDaddyAl got it right again. We may be seeing a lot less overt racism over the past 50 years, but there is a lot of covert racism still here, and there is a lot of disparity and lots of laws and regulations still on the books to be dealt with.

I don't blame the NAACP for using their 1st amendment right to speak up about Robertson's clearly racist and revisionist comments.

Again, NOT racist
 
...well, lemme see,

1. you asked for proof of something I stated and I provided it.

2. Rick, and others asked you for proof of some of your accusations, and you failed to provide it.

3. you failed miserably.

EXACTLY!
 
Proof of what? The facts and the morality were clearly on my side.

wait, you are claiming you are on the same side as morality yet are claiming homosexuality isn't a sin when the bible clearly says it is... that is comical!
 
Al Sharpton with his ONE SIDED rhetoric sets the civil rights movement back 30 years every time he opens his racist mouth. And most of the attention he gets is for race baiting every time a person of color is accused of something but no where in site when it comes from the other side. Now there is man known for using the race card at the drop of a hat. And more so then this guy Robertson deserves the label of bigot.

Exactly correct... as well as Jackson (not quite as bad), mr obama, and Oprah as well...
 
Denny you may want to re-read your post on page 3 #62 where you VERY CLEARLY said, "Only a racist would say that black people were happy picking cotton,drinking from seperate water fountains, sitting in the back of buses & getting there food from the rear entrances of restaurants.

I asked on at least 3 different posts for you to show me where Robertson said all those things & you've still not shown me. The cotton fields he only described what he saw & perceived to be at that time. All the other shit he never said. You made it up.

EXACTLY!
 
There's only so many ways I can order the words. You ignore them and deny I wrote them.

I answered you each and every time. One post even had two photos in it.

I'm not the only guy in this thread who saw his clearly racist remarks.

Photos had NOTHING to do with Phil Robertson... NOTHING.. and he never said any of that other crap... you never answered... you made crap up
 
Let's try a different tack. Without civil rights movement, all the black people we all know would be happy?

Tell me your version of what it would be like.

The guy said black people were happy without all that. The photos prove they weren't.

Who said there weren't benefits from the civil rights movement??? NO ONE... BUT, there were aspects to life where people were happy... they didn't expect things to be handed to them, they worked for it and were happy to get what they worked for. Phil was saying people were happier as a whole prior to entitlement and welfare... when did he ever say people were happier before they were given civil rights??????????? When did he even imply it?
 
Photos had NOTHING to do with Phil Robertson... NOTHING.. and he never said any of that other crap... you never answered... you made crap up

Photos were from before welfare, which he did say. People in the photos were singing all right: "we shall overcome."
 
Who said there weren't benefits from the civil rights movement??? NO ONE... BUT, there were aspects to life where people were happy... they didn't expect things to be handed to them, they worked for it and were happy to get what they worked for. Phil was saying people were happier as a whole prior to entitlement and welfare... when did he ever say people were happier before they were given civil rights??????????? When did he even imply it?

Where did he say any of that?

Uh, LOL?
 
Again. Deny it again.

OK, the exact quote from Phil was "Pre-entitlement, pre-welfare, you say: Were they happy? They were godly; they were happy; no one was singing the blues." When did he mention civil rights? water fountains? buses? any of that? he didn't...

He could have said it a little better, but he was saying that entitlement and welfare has not made people happy... in fact, it's done the opposite... that was it...
 
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