Trade Idea Post and Discuss Trade Ideas for the 2019-20 Season (4 Viewers)

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Reep said:
I'm tired of seeing teams with tall 2 guards take their lunch money repeatedly. We have no answer for a team that doesn't also have two short guards. With Nurkic, Collins, Ariza/Little behind them, it covers up some of these weaknesses, but I personally am done with a defense that uses two short defense minus guards in the starting lineup.
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How many teams have a tall SG, and how much of it is really attributed to their size vs CJs? The size thing is overstated.
 
RR7 said:
Random idea

Atlanta In:Whiteside
Atlanta Out: Len, Turner

They've been targeting other Cs in rumors. Apparently to shift Collins to PF. They get a half season tryout of Whiteside and bird rights.

Minnesota In: Turner, Len
Minnesota Out: Dieng, Vonleh

They shave a year off of Dieng's deal by taking on a little more salary this season.

Portland In: Dieng, Vonleh
Portland Out: Whiteside.

Get a temporary C replacement in Dieng until Nurk and Skal are back. Also, have insurance for next season, as well as a big expiring next year to deal.
Also gets us out of the tax.
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Would also give us an $11M TPE.
 
tester551 said:
Yep. Wood is one that I was hoping the Blazers would take a serious look at.
His advanced metrics in the gleague were very good....

I'd really like Portland to be a bit more proactive with the end of the roster & turn it over during the season more (sign guys to 10 day contracts) to uncover hidden gems.
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Been saying exactly this. Olshey sucks at finding hidden gems... They're littered across the league, but Olshey seems content with going for retreads (Stauskas, Hezonja) or washed up players (Tolliver, Gasol).
 
BonesJones said:
How many teams have a tall SG, and how much of it is really attributed to their size vs CJs? The size thing is overstated.
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The size thing may be overstated in some cases where the guy is CJs size but a much better defender. The defense thing is not over-stated. I don't know why you wouldn't want a superior defender at shooting guard. Is defense over-stated?
 
If we’re looking at possible diamonds in the rough, how about Elie Okobo? Phoenix has Rubio and probably wouldn’t mind opening up more minutes for Ty Jerome. They also have another capable guard in Jevon Carter. Point is, Okobo could be had. Still only 22. His assist percentage would rank him second on Portland. He’s got length too so he can guard multiple positions. With Hezonja busting and Simons struggling, we could realllly use a guy that can run the second unit.
 
BonesJones said:
How many teams have a tall SG, and how much of it is really attributed to their size vs CJs? The size thing is overstated.
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lots of teams have taller SG's, but that isn't the entire problem. Portland only has one guard over 6'3, and the one they just traded away was 6'4

I think Denver is about the only team that has a starting back court as small as Portland. Maybe Toronto. But I haven't looked lately

there's Dame & CJ, and since it became their team they've led a parade of small guards...Tim Frazier, Brian Roberts, Shabazz Napier, Seth Curry, and Simons. If that was a string of true backup PG's it wouldn't be so bad, but other than Frazier, that's basically a list of dwarf SG's
 
wizenheimer said:
lots of teams have taller SG's, but that isn't the entire problem. Portland only has one guard over 6'3, and the one they just traded away was 6'4

I think Denver is about the only team that has a starting back court as small as Portland. Maybe Toronto. But I haven't looked lately

there's Dame & CJ, and since it became their team they've led a parade of small guards...Tim Frazier, Brian Roberts, Shabazz Napier, Seth Curry, and Simons. If that was a string of true backup PG's it wouldn't be so bad, but other than Frazier, that's basically a list of dwarf SG's
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Toronto is far smaller. Theyre 34-14.
Charlotte, Washington, Sacramento, Utah, Denver, Cleveland, ... Clippers play Pat Bev and Lou together in crunch time and thats smaller. Might be misisng some.

I rarely see CJ get abused for his "lack of height". Defense doesnt come down to a 1 to 2 inch difference between perimeter players.
 
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BonesJones said:
Toronto is far smaller. Theyre 34-14.
Charlotte, Washington, Sacramento, Utah, Denver, Cleveland, ... Clippers play Pat Bev and Lou together in crunch time and thats smaller. Might be misisng some.

I rarely see CJ get abused for his "lack of height". Defense doesnt come down to a 1 to 2 inch difference between perimeter players.
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This guy defends CJ’s defense but thinks Whiteside is empty stats... smh
 
BonesJones said:
Toronto is far smaller. Theyre 34-14.
Charlotte, Washington, Sacramento, Utah, Denver, Cleveland, ... Clippers play Pat Bev and Lou together in crunch time and thats smaller. Might be misisng some.

I rarely see CJ get abused for his "lack of height". Defense doesnt come down to a 1 to 2 inch difference between perimeter players.
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CJ is abused all the time defensively, and his length and size is one reason. IIRC, his wingspan is about 1.5 inches less than Dame's

I mentioned Toronto but they aren't "far smaller"; Lowry, Powell, and Van Vleet are all very physical players for their size, and size is part of the equation. The Kings have 6'4 Heild, and 6'6 Bogdanovic has replaced Heild lately as a starter. Utah runs 6'7 Ingles at SG a lot of the time. None of the Clippers top-5 lineups have Beverly and Williams, and of course, Beverly is a very good defender so it's not quite the same thing. They also have 6'5 Shamet, and Harkless spends 41% of his minutes at SG if bbref is to be believed

the main thing though is that Dame and CJ have the same defensive deficiencies (as well as some offensive redundancies). Dame/Matthews was a better pairing on both ends of the floor because they didn't have so many overlapping weaknesses and weren't as redundant on offense.
 
wizenheimer said:
CJ is abused all the time defensively, and his length and size is one reason. IIRC, his wingspan is about 1.5 inches less than Dame's

I mentioned Toronto but they aren't "far smaller"; Lowry, Powell, and Van Vleet are all very physical players for their size, and size is part of the equation. The Kings have 6'4 Heild, and 6'6 Bogdanovic has replaced Heild lately as a starter. Utah runs 6'7 Ingles at SG a lot of the time. None of the Clippers top-5 lineups have Beverly and Williams, and of course, Beverly is a very good defender so it's not quite the same thing. They also have 6'5 Shamet, and Harkless spends 41% of his minutes at SG if bbref is to be believed

the main thing though is that Dame and CJ have the same defensive deficiencies (as well as some offensive redundancies). Dame/Matthews was a better pairing on both ends of the floor because they didn't have so many overlapping weaknesses and weren't as redundant on offense.
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That's the generic narrative, but it's overstating what's actually happening out there on the floor.

Hield's barely over 6'3 without shoes, but sure, lets argue a half an inch because it's so important. But you're going to argue whatever angle you can get here "Well these guys are physical, this guy is playing more than this guy now, this guy runs SG with the bench unit, Harkless plays 40% of his minutes at SG (seriously?)..." That's why I can't even have a legitimate conversation with you.

And did you seriously use the "redundant" argument as if having two good 3-level scorers at the guard spots who can play off each other is a BAD thing? Haha. Okay. If we didn't have that redundancy, we don't win Game 7 of the WCSF last year, and there's many other games like that where we need a second go-to scorer since Dame is either struggling or teams are loading up on him.

At this point, I'm convinced you'd HATE the idea of having two Lillard's at the guard spots, because they'd be "too small" and "too redundant".
 
Sarni said:
GSW are not trading Russell for a mid first rounder, come on.
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And how the hell would Minnesota trade RoCo and Dieng without anything else and get back Russell?
 
Neil O. Shyster said:
This guy defends CJ’s defense but thinks Whiteside is empty stats... smh
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I'm debating the narrative that "CJ's defense sucks because he's too small" narrative. The only glaring weakness with his defense is actually his off-ball defense, which isn't height based. He's not a good on-ball defender, but he's not horrible and he doesn't get killed for a lack of size like people try to claim. SGs in today's NBA don't post up, or face up, and a couple inch difference doesn't have some insanely huge impact on CJs defense like people claim.
 
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Here's a serious question for CJ fans. How good would somebody like Trent have to get before you would be willing to trade CJ for an upgrade at another position? (EG would his becoming another Wes Matthews be enough?)
 
oldmangrouch said:
Here's a serious question for CJ fans. How good would somebody like Trent have to get before you would be willing to trade CJ for an upgrade at another position? (EG would his becoming another Wes Matthews be enough?)
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I'm not a huge "CJ-fan", dude gets too much undue hate though.

But to answer your question, if Trent became a consistent 40% 3pt shooter with really good and we didn't have forwards at that level on the roster and we got a 3-and-D forward that was better than CJ, then I'd entertain it. But I think trading him is playing with fire, so it'd take the right situation.

As far as Trent goes though, I'm not sure he's a good enough ball handler to be a starting SG. I think he's more of a SF.
 
BonesJones said:
I'm not a huge "CJ-fan", dude gets too much undue hate though.

But to answer your question, if Trent became a consistent 40% 3pt shooter with really good and we didn't have forwards at that level on the roster and we got a 3-and-D forward that was better than CJ, then I'd entertain it. But I think trading him is playing with fire, so it'd take the right situation.

As far as Trent goes though, I'm not sure he's a good enough ball handler to be a starting SG. I think he's more of a SF.
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I don’t think the hate is undue... he is gonna make 30+ mil for the next 4 seasons. He is paid like a superstar but plays like more of a Lou Williams/Jamal Crawford role as a microwave offensive player with poor defense... and his ISO ball mentality makes It even worse... it’s the fact that the money could be spent elsewhere and a guy like Trent could fill in admirably
 
Scalma said:
If we’re looking at possible diamonds in the rough, how about Elie Okobo? Phoenix has Rubio and probably wouldn’t mind opening up more minutes for Ty Jerome. They also have another capable guard in Jevon Carter. Point is, Okobo could be had. Still only 22. His assist percentage would rank him second on Portland. He’s got length too so he can guard multiple positions. With Hezonja busting and Simons struggling, we could realllly use a guy that can run the second unit.
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I was thinking about him. I'd like to see him on the Blazers...
What do the Suns need? Any hope for a trade there?
 
Neil O. Shyster said:
My bad... I saw your constant posts of wanting him traded so I thought you also posted the empty stats argument
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I've said many times that me wanting to trade him isn't based on him as a player or his play.
 
Neil O. Shyster said:
I don’t think the hate is undue... he is gonna make 30+ mil for the next 4 seasons. He is paid like a superstar but plays like more of a Lou Williams/Jamal Crawford role as a microwave offensive player with poor defense... and his ISO ball mentality makes It even worse... it’s the fact that the money could be spent elsewhere and a guy like Trent could fill in admirably
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Almost anyone who gets 21-22 PPG is worth a max contract. Since Game 11, CJ's been decently efficient as well. He started the season in a slump but has been really good since then.

CJ has improved his style of play offensively and his playmaking for others has seen an uptick but CJ-haters don't want to admit that.

Lou Williams is probably worth $20M+. He doesn't play CJ's minutes though, but on a per minute basis he's an elite offensive players.

I just don't understand how a MAX contract for a guy getting 22/4/4 with decent efficiency is greatly overpaying someone... Doesn't make sense to me.
 
BonesJones said:
at this point, I'm convinced you'd HATE the idea of having two Lillard's at the guard spots, because they'd be "too small" and "too redundant".
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I can't help it if you've convinced yourself of something that's just dumb

Two Lillards would be a hell of a lot better than what Portland has because that would increase the talent in the back court and on the team immensely, and of course, teams wouldn't be able to trap Lillard1 or Lillard2 anymore because the other would take over. That kind of redundancy would be better than the redundancy they currently have
 
BonesJones said:
At this point, I'm convinced you'd HATE the idea of having two Lillard's at the guard spots, because they'd be "too small" and "too redundant".
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I'd LOVE to have two Lillard's. The issue is CJ is not in Lillards league as a player. Never has been & never will be.

Dame is so good, he has a net positive impact on the team.
CJ is usually a net neutral.
 
We could probably get Derrick rose with our first. Imagine having him off the bench next year when we're full strength.
 
If the current trade buzz is accurate, the general market for young frontcourt players is robust, with league executives saying both the Indiana Pacers' Myles Turner and the Atlanta Hawks' John Collins, big men with the ability to switch between power forward and center, are on the trading block.
https://bleacherreport.com/articles...rs-clips-d-rose-might-shake-up-trade-deadline
https://bleacherreport.com/articles...rs-clips-d-rose-might-shake-up-trade-deadline
That article also makes it sound like Harrell might be available with the clippers looking for a legit center. We can’t take Harkless so maybe a three team trade with Sacramento.

 
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