OT El Paso shooting: 22 Dead, 24 Inured. Dayton shooting: 9 Dead, 16 Injured

[Fez Hammersticks]

 

[Chris Craig]

That's about it

 

[SlyPokerDog]

 

[Chris Craig]

Likewise. I own an AK-47, and I voted for Trump. And I don't appreciate you associating me with a crazy mass murderer.

I didn't associate you with anyone. The shooters of both these attacks yesterday are White Nationalist Trump Fans with Assault rifles. It's what it is

 

[Chris Craig]

It would appear that thoughts and prayers aren't working.

No they are not. We need to stop this shit.

 

[theprunetang]

 

[MARIS61]

50 years of Socialists running our public schools has successfully created a populace that never learned anything about freedom in America.

Anyone and everyone who claims The Second Amendment applies only to certain weapons, only to certain people, only to the military...is either a purposeful liar, has a poor grasp of the English language, or (the majority) is completely ignorant of US History and the reasons why and methods used to ensure this country was created and would be able to prevent tyranny from our government.

If you don't like that, we have a legislative process you can pursue to attempt to repeal The Second Amendment.

It will fail miserably because you are part of a very loud, but small herd of sheep and Real Americans know Our Bill of Rights and Constitution makes us the closest thing on Earth to a free country. Nobody else comes close.

But, if you actually succeeded in repealing it, you've accomplished nothing. Our Bill Of Rights does not grant any rights, it merely re-affirms that all Americans are born free and these rights are inherent at birth. They are permanent as long as we breathe.

200 million Real Americans will still have upwards of 800 million guns.

Are you actually so evil you would murder 200 million American men, women and children, and an untold number of American military and LEOs?

Because that's the only possible result to your silly parlor game.

Now THAT's a mass "shooting"!

 

[Jade Falcon]

I didn't associate you with anyone. The shooters of both these attacks yesterday are White Nationalist Trump Fans with Assault rifles. It's what it is

So being a supporter of the President, and owning an AK-47. Sounds to me like guilt by association.

I don't know about you, but I've never blamed Jusuf Nurkic for terrorist atrocities committed by ISIS in the Middle East just because he's Muslim.

 

[Chris Craig]

So being a supporter of the President, and owning an AK-47. Sounds to me like guilt by association.

I don't know about you, but I've never blamed Jusuf Nurkic for terrorist atrocities committed by ISIS in the Middle East just because he's Muslim.

If your feeling guilty, that's on you

 

[Jade Falcon]

If your feeling guilty, that's on you

I don't feel guilty at all. I'm disgusted that a moderator on a forum is allowed to label those whom he disagrees with as being white supremacists and terrorists.

 

[Chris Craig]

I don't feel guilty at all. I'm disgusted that a moderator on a forum is allowed to label those whom he disagrees with as being white supremacists and terrorists.

I never called you a white supremacist or a terrorist. Or anyone on here for that matter.

I pointed out the shooters are white nationalist/supremacist Trump Lovers with assault rifles. Fact.

 

[Jade Falcon]

I never called you a white supremacist or a terrorist. Or anyone on here for that matter.

I pointed out the shooters are white supremacist Trump Lovers with assault rifles. Fact.

So you agree then that those who support Trump and own guns are not white supremacists or terrorists?

 

[Chris Craig]

So you agree then that those who support Trump and own guns are not white supremacists or terrorists?

Not all of them no. I never said that. I said these shooters are. If that associates you or anyone on here with them. That is not on me.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

I'm disgusted that a moderator on a forum is allowed to label those whom he disagrees with as being white supremacists and terrorists.

I think many of us have been guilty of making generalizations at times that weren't reflective of the members of this community. That said, as long as Chris or any staff member doesn't violate the personal insult rule they are free to post their opinions. Being staff doesn't make them give that up.

 

[Jade Falcon]

Not all of them no. I never said that. I said these shooters are.

Thank you for clarifying.

Unfortunately it seems like fringe elements from both sides are becoming more prevalent. I hope this isn't the case. I would like to think that 90% of this country is still good people with rational minds.

 

[Jade Falcon]

I think many of us have been guilty of making generalizations at times that weren't reflective of the members of this community. That said, as long as Chris or any staff member doesn't violate the personal insult rule they are free to post their opinions. Being staff doesn't make them give that up.

I appreciate that, thank you. He clarified his position on the matter. Perhaps a little too much generalization for me personally, but yes, many of us are guilty of this from time to time. And this topic is indeed a hot-button issue that brings out emotions on all sides.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

I appreciate that, thank you. He clarified his position on the matter. Perhaps a little too much generalization for me personally, but yes, many of us are guilty of this from time to time. And this topic is indeed a hot-button issue that brings out emotions on all sides.

I love you!

 

[Jade Falcon]

I love you!

I LOVE YOU TOO SLY!

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

I think many of us have been guilty of making generalizations at times that weren't reflective of the members of this community. That said, as long as Chris or any staff member doesn't violate the personal insult rule they are free to post their opinions. Being staff doesn't make them give that up.

Your site your rules but it’s weird to me that I can insult large groups of people because thats my opinion but I cant insult an individual, so basically if I want to insult you, I just insult Dogs in general and then run off and say well, I didn't say YOU!

Again, I try to abide by the rules here and be respectful to people whether I agree with them or not but it seems like thats how the “insults” usually happen, and why people feel insulted, its because if you, “describe” generalities and I fall into them, then you throw out insults, wouldn't any logical person or dog, take that as an insult?

is it ok to insult all blacks, whites, whatever as long as I don't put a name on it?

I mean there are posts in this thread that paint all Autistic people as basically crazy unsafe people, posts in here are very emotionally charged (for good reason), but saying just generally insult everyone seems, like were also allowing vague personal/not personal insults.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Your site your rules but it’s weird to me that I can insult large groups of people because thats my opinion but I cant insult an individual, so basically if I want to insult you, I just insult Dogs in general and then run off and say well, I didn't say YOU!

Again, I try to abide by the rules here and be respectful to people whether I agree with them or not but it seems like thats how the “insults” usually happen, and why people feel insulted, its because if you, “describe” generalities and I fall into them, then you throw out insults, wouldn't any logical person or dog, take that as an insult?

is it ok to insult all blacks, whites, whatever as long as I don't put a name on it?

I mean there are posts in this thread that paint all Autistic people as basically crazy unsafe people, posts in here are very emotionally charged (for good reason), but saying just generally insult everyone seems, like were also allowing vague personal/not personal insults.

You insult someone personally it leads to a straight up argument and back and forth name calling. Insulting a group of people doesn't really generate the same hate and volatility. It's all about promoting healthy and fun discussions and debates with as few of rules as possible. It never will be perfect. We will never catch or prevent everything. It can be a bit of a challenge because this isn't just some place to talk on the internet. This is a community of passionate fans that often meets in public. That is a huge part of the personal insult rule.

It's a big reason why I tell staff that we are more like firemen than cops. We're not looking to arrest people and enforce the laws, we're looking to put out fires and arguments.

 

[Jade Falcon]

Your site your rules but it’s weird to me that I can insult large groups of people because thats my opinion but I cant insult an individual, so basically if I want to insult you, I just insult Dogs in general and then run off and say well, I didn't say YOU!

Again, I try to abide by the rules here and be respectful to people whether I agree with them or not but it seems like thats how the “insults” usually happen, and why people feel insulted, its because if you, “describe” generalities and I fall into them, then you throw out insults, wouldn't any logical person or dog, take that as an insult?

is it ok to insult all blacks, whites, whatever as long as I don't put a name on it?

I mean there are posts in this thread that paint all Autistic people as basically crazy unsafe people, posts in here are very emotionally charged (for good reason), but saying just generally insult everyone seems, like were also allowing vague personal/not personal insults.

I agree with this. Generalizations can be just as bad as a direct insult.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

You insult someone personally it leads to a straight up argument and back and forth name calling. Insulting a group of people doesn't really generate the same hate and volatility. It's all about promoting healthy and fun discussions and debates with as few of rules as possible. It never will be perfect. We will never catch or prevent everything. It can be a bit of a challenge because this isn't just some place to talk on the internet. This is a community of passionate fans that often meets in public. That is a huge part of the personal insult rule.

It's a big reason why I tell staff that we are more like firemen than cops. We're not looking to arrest people and enforce the laws, we're looking to put out fires and arguments.

Fair enough. I realize we make your job (that you volunteer for) harder than it needs to be. I appreciate the dialogue. I still sometimes think things can go from 1-100 really freaking fast at times, but thats the nature of allowing people to speak their opinions. Ive been at a number of community things, have friendships that have sprouted from here.

 

[Jade Falcon]

Insulting a group of people doesn't really generate the same hate and volatility. It's all about promoting healthy and fun discussions and debates with as few of rules as possible.

Really? I don't find anything healthy or fun about generalizations. In fact, I'm pretty sure that many Liberals are staunchly against this when the President supposedly does it. In fact....they tell me it "generates the same hate and volatility" as a personal insult.

I think this was a poor choice of words on your part, Sly.

 

[Chris Craig]

Really? I don't find anything healthy or fun about generalizations. In fact, I'm pretty sure that many Liberals are staunchly against this when the President supposedly does it. In fact....they tell me it "generates the same hate and volatility" as a personal insult.

I think this was a poor choice of words on your part, Sly.

Generalizations? I stated fact.

 

[Jade Falcon]

Generalizations? I stated fact.

You stated facts about those shooters. Not about Trump voters or gun owners.

And by the way, his Manifesto specifically said Trump had nothing to do with his actions.

But according to you, I guess I'm supposed to blame Maxine Waters for ANTIFA, shooting Republicans at a baseball game, and fire bombing a detention facility in Seattle?

 

[Chris Craig]

You stated facts about those shooters. Not about Trump voters or gun owners.

And by the way, his Manifesto specifically said Trump had nothing to do with his actions.

But according to you, I guess I'm supposed to blame Maxine Waters for ANTIFA, shooting Republicans at a baseball game, and fire bombing a detention facility in Seattle?

His manifesto said he was a white nationalist before Trump. Trump emboldened him with his divisive rhetoric.

I said these shooters yesterday and in California a week ago are white nationalist/supremacists emboldened by Trump. They are Trump fanboys. Facts

Again, if that makes you feel associated with them. That is not on me.

 

[Jade Falcon]

Trump emboldened him with his divisive rhetoric.

Opinion based on emotion and not fact, nor did he say anything about being a white nationalist. Trump is no more responsible for this man's actions than Obama was for Micah Xavier Johnson killing police officers in Dallas. Or do you want to blame that one on BLM?

 

[Chris Craig]

Opinion based on emotion and not fact, nor did he say anything about being a white nationalist. Trump is no more responsible for this man's actions than Obama was for Micah Xavier Johnson killing police officers in Dallas. Or do you want to blame that one on BLM?

Trump is responsible. He goes around spewing hateful rhetoric about immigrants and minorities. Guys that are listening to him are taking what he is saying and going and killing masses of people. That is a very dangerous thing and needs to be looked at.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

Trump is responsible. He goes around spewing hateful rhetoric about immigrants and minorities. Guys that are listening to him are taking what he is saying and going and killing masses of people. That is a very dangerous thing and needs to be looked at.

Maga guys will never admit this.

It's time to deflect - it's their M.O.

 

[Jade Falcon]

Trump is responsible. He goes around spewing hateful rhetoric about immigrants and minorities. Guys that are listening to him are taking what he is saying and going and killing masses of people. That is a very dangerous thing and needs to be looked at.

Bullshit. He's no more responsible for this than Maxine Waters is for some Liberals who hate the police and white people. Stop this nonsense.

If you don't have enough self-control to be out in society without killing innocent people, then it doesn't matter who says what....you are going to go off at anything. If it wasn't hatred of corporations, those who pollute the environment, and Mexicans, then it probably would have been a road rage incident or killing his domestic spouse/girlfriend/domestic partner.

Self control is a thing. Personal responsibility is a reality. Obama said things I didn't agree with In fact, many politicians have said things I don't agree with....and yet, never once have I ever even come close to considering mass murder.

These people are crazy. Psychos. Are we REALLY going to allow them to dictate the policies or rhetoric of this country through violent actions?