Kevin Love sweepstakes

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Eastoff said:
You guys do see that big black mask inhibiting his vision, right?
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To be fair, Collins said it isn't effecting his vision. Maybe he was downplaying it.

I'm pretty sure that the team told him to use summer league to work on his post game. Otherwise he would be popping threes like the regular season. Summer league is great for trying out new things. He will continue to grow in the post. He hasn't finished everything well, but he has had some nice moves and footwork--and that is while playing with only one decent, but inexperienced, point guard. He will look much different playing in the regular season. Likely only posting up when he has a size advantage, or receiving a dump from Dame or Nurk.
 
BLAZINGGIANTS said:
If Kevin Love were 27-28, maybe I’d consider dealing Collins for Love. But he’ll be 30 when the season begins. He’s not the healthiest. I’ve never been a huge Love fan, to be fair. He’s always put up good numbers, but so did Abdur-Rahim.
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Absolutely true. However, KLove's game isn't really built on athleticism, so he may be good for a little while longer than some others.
 
andalusian said:
Zach Collins is going to be a much better defensive player that Kevin Love will ever be.

Offense he will be an average+ player at least, I suspect, but he has the tools to be more
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ZCo was a better defender at age 18 than Love at his peak.
ZCo is a much better shot blocker than Love.
Love is a much better rebounder than ZCo.
Love is a much better outlet passer than ZCo.
Love is a much, much better post player than ZCo.
Soon, ZCo will be as good a 3 point shooter as Love.
 
When Zach Collins is just entering his prime around 26 Damian will be 34 and just on the tail end of his. So if your planning on winning with Dame you trade Zack, if not I think you go the other way and quietly start shopping Dame because he's not going to win with this team.
 
BigGameDamian said:
When Zach Collins is just entering his prime around 26 Damian will be 34 and just on the tail end of his. So if your planning on winning with Dame you trade Zack, if not I think you go the other way and quietly start shopping Dame because he's not going to win with this team.
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#notthis
 
People, are we saying we believe Z-CO won't be as good offensively as Ryan Anderson?

He'll AT LEAST be that good offensively.
 
dviss1 said:
People, are we saying we believe Z-CO won't be as good offensively as Ryan Anderson?

He'll AT LEAST be that good offensively.
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With his defensive acumen, if he's at least as good offensively as Ryan Anderson, he'll be a hall-of-famer. And I don't think he'll be a hall-of-famer.
 
I honestly think the Blazers brass front office is so torn. They don't know what direction to move in. A youth movement (Build around both Collins and Nurk) or get Dame and CJ the players they need to complete.
 
BigGameDamian said:
I honestly think the Blazers brass front office is so torn. They don't know what direction to move in. A youth movement (Build around both Collins and Nurk) or get Dame and CJ the players they need to complete.
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I would bet that they are more torn about moving CJ or not, or what to do with ET. I don't get the impression they are truly considering a rebuild by moving Dame.
 
BigGameDamian said:
I honestly think the Blazers brass front office is so torn. They don't know what direction to move in. A youth movement (Build around both Collins and Nurk) or get Dame and CJ the players they need to complete.
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I don't think they're torn. Just realizing reality and going half and half. We have to hope to nail on our draft picks because getting a free agent superstar to pick us would be like winning the lottery. Trades is our only other real option besides the draft. Even then these superstars can block the trade by saying they hate Portland haha
 
Driew said:
I don't think they're torn. Just realizing reality and going half and half. We have to hope to nail on our draft picks because getting a free agent superstar to pick us would be like winning the lottery. Trades is our only other real option besides the draft. Even then these superstars can block the trade by saying they hate Portland haha
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I hate to even think this out loud, but I wonder if PA will eventually get tired of being frozen out of the FA market, believe that Portland cannot compete in today's NBA, and move the team up north. As a fan I would hate it, but as a business person I can see how it would make a lot of sense. There may even be some Blazer fans outside of Portland that would think this would be the best way to compete.
 
Maybe Neil is just doing what he's best at (1st round):
2012: Lillard - Hit
2012: Biebs - Gamble (Miss)
2013: CJ - Hit
2014: No Pick
2015: Traded Pick for Starting Center - Hit
2016: No Pick
2017: Collins - Hit
2018: Simons - Hit

I don't know what happened with the 2014 and 2016 picks, but whatever happened, it was
probably an error for Neil to trade the picks considering his draft acumen.

Imagine that we drafted a Collins-equivalent in 2014, and a Simons-equivalent in 2016. Right now we'd be dope.
 
Wizard Mentor said:
Maybe Neil is just doing what he's best at (1st round):
2012: Lillard - Hit
2012: Biebs - Gamble (Miss)
2013: CJ - Hit
2014: No Pick
2015: Traded Pick for Starting Center - Hit
2016: No Pick
2017: Collins - Hit
2018: Simons - Hit

I don't know what happened with the 2014 and 2016 picks, but whatever happened, it was
probably an error for Neil to trade the picks considering his draft acumen.

Imagine that we drafted a Collins-equivalent in 2014, and a Simons-equivalent in 2016. Right now we'd be dope.
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2014 was a result of getting Gerald Wallace, which happened before Olshey got here. However not trading that pick would likely mean no Lillard.

2016 was due to the Afflalo trade. Our pick was lottery protected and Olshey didn't think we'd make the playoffs if Aldridge left but we did.
 
Wizard Mentor said:
Maybe Neil is just doing what he's best at (1st round):
2012: Lillard - Hit
2012: Biebs - Gamble (Miss)
2013: CJ - Hit
2014: No Pick
2015: Traded Pick for Starting Center - Hit
2016: No Pick
2017: Collins - Hit
2018: Simons - Hit

I don't know what happened with the 2014 and 2016 picks, but whatever happened, it was
probably an error for Neil to trade the picks considering his draft acumen.

Imagine that we drafted a Collins-equivalent in 2014, and a Simons-equivalent in 2016. Right now we'd be dope.
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Don't forget Will the Thrill in 2012, second round. I would call that a hit. But unfortunately you should also include Swanigan in 2017 (first round) (miss).
 
Reep said:
I hate to even think this out loud, but I wonder if PA will eventually get tired of being frozen out of the FA market, believe that Portland cannot compete in today's NBA, and move the team up north. As a fan I would hate it, but as a business person I can see how it would make a lot of sense. There may even be some Blazer fans outside of Portland that would think this would be the best way to compete.
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An owner can't just move the team. He would have to have league approval and commissioner approval. There is no chance of that happening as the Rose Garden (I know it's not called that right now) is still a really good facility. Allen also owns (at least part of it) the Rose Garden so he'd have a big building that he'd struggle to find tenants for. It would be a horrible business decision.

There is 0% chance of this happening.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
With his defensive acumen, if he's at least as good offensively as Ryan Anderson, he'll be a hall-of-famer. And I don't think he'll be a hall-of-famer.
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I don't really know how to respond to this.

Sure he may not be a hall of fame candidate but he'll definitely be as good as Ryan Anderson offensively. He already has better post footwork. Strength is Zach's biggest issue. He'll turn into every bit the shooter Anderson is.
 
Reep said:
I hate to even think this out loud, but I wonder if PA will eventually get tired of being frozen out of the FA market, believe that Portland cannot compete in today's NBA, and move the team up north. As a fan I would hate it, but as a business person I can see how it would make a lot of sense. There may even be some Blazer fans outside of Portland that would think this would be the best way to compete.
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Seattle has the same problem as Portland and that's the only place he'd consider moving them.

When you have a yacht so big that has speedboats and a helicopter, it doesn't matter where you live. You live everywhere.
 
dviss1 said:
I don't really know how to respond to this.

Sure he may not be a hall of fame candidate but he'll definitely be as good as Ryan Anderson offensively. He already has better post footwork. Strength is Zach's biggest issue. He'll turn into every bit the shooter Anderson is.
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All I'm saying is that you're setting a pretty high bar for Zach's offense. By his second year in the league, Ryan Anderson had a .574 TS%; his 3 years in Orlando, his TS% was .586, with an OBPM of 4.5. He shot 39% from 3.

Zach already had a DBPM of 0.9 last year. I only assume that he won't get worse. Here's the list of front-court players since 2000 that have been at least as good offensively as Ryan Anderson and at least as good defensively as Zach Collins over a single season. It's a very short list.

I don't believe that Zach will reach that offensive bar; but if he does, this team is a contender.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
All I'm saying is that you're setting a pretty high bar for Zach's offense. By his second year in the league, Ryan Anderson had a .574 TS%; his 3 years in Orlando, his TS% was .586, with an OBPM of 4.5. He shot 39% from 3.

Zach already had a DBPM of 0.9 last year. I only assume that he won't get worse. Here's the list of front-court players since 2000 that have been at least as good offensively as Ryan Anderson and at least as good defensively as Zach Collins over a single season. It's a very short list.

I don't believe that Zach will reach that offensive bar; but if he does, this team is a contender.
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It's weird that the list includes 3 players (Dirk, Love ironically, and Jokic) that are not known for their defensive prowess.
 
hoopsjock said:
An owner can't just move the team. He would have to have league approval and commissioner approval. There is no chance of that happening as the Rose Garden (I know it's not called that right now) is still a really good facility. Allen also owns (at least part of it) the Rose Garden so he'd have a big building that he'd struggle to find tenants for. It would be a horrible business decision.

There is 0% chance of this happening.
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I didn't say it would happen this month. My suggestion was I wonder if he would consider it. I know of all the steps that must be taken. I also know that the big building and other costs would not be a consideration if PA really believed he could build a contender in Seattle.
 
dviss1 said:
Seattle has the same problem as Portland and that's the only place he'd consider moving them.

When you have a yacht so big that has speedboats and a helicopter, it doesn't matter where you live. You live everywhere.
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I will be honest, that if I had a boatload of money (as an NBA player) and could live anywhere, it wouldn't be Portland or Seattle. But, Seattle arguably has more big city stuff than Portland does. In today's world that might not matter, as people seem to be preferring the dryer, warmer air of the southwest.
 
Reep said:
I didn't say it would happen this month. My suggestion was I wonder if he would consider it. I know of all the steps that must be taken. I also know that the big building and other costs would not be a consideration if PA really believed he could build a contender in Seattle.
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Are you not reading my post? It isn't up to Allen. Even if he wanted to move the team, the NBA will not let the team leave Portland. The only reason he let the Sonics leave is because the city wasn't willing to take the necessary steps to upgrade/build an arena. That isn't an issue in Portland. The Blazers will not move under any circumstances.
 
BigGameDamian said:
I honestly think the Blazers brass front office is so torn. They don't know what direction to move in. A youth movement (Build around both Collins and Nurk) or get Dame and CJ the players they need to complete.
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Why not both? Or even a third option: Get Dame/Nurk/Collins the players they need to compete.
 
hoopsjock said:
Are you not reading my post? It isn't up to Allen. Even if he wanted to move the team, the NBA will not let the team leave Portland. The only reason he let the Sonics leave is because the city wasn't willing to take the necessary steps to upgrade/build an arena. That isn't an issue in Portland. The Blazers will not move under any circumstances.
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Okay, we just have a difference of opinion. You believe that Paul Allen, with all his pull and money couldn't eventually (at some point in the future) find a way to get this team to Seattle. I think it possibly could.

However, you are missing the entire point of my original post. I was wondering if it would be easier to get FAs in Seattle as opposed to Portland.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
All I'm saying is that you're setting a pretty high bar for Zach's offense. By his second year in the league, Ryan Anderson had a .574 TS%; his 3 years in Orlando, his TS% was .586, with an OBPM of 4.5. He shot 39% from 3.

Zach already had a DBPM of 0.9 last year. I only assume that he won't get worse. Here's the list of front-court players since 2000 that have been at least as good offensively as Ryan Anderson and at least as good defensively as Zach Collins over a single season. It's a very short list.

I don't believe that Zach will reach that offensive bar; but if he does, this team is a contender.
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Oh ye of so little faith.
 
I like Zach's future, but if we could do a Butler/CJ swap, then I would be much more interested in Love for Collins.

Dame/Curry/Simons
Butler/Stauskas/Trent/
Harkless/Turner
Love/Aminu/Layman
Nurkic/Swanigan/Biebs
 
Reep said:
Okay, we just have a difference of opinion. You believe that Paul Allen, with all his pull and money couldn't eventually (at some point in the future) find a way to get this team to Seattle. I think it possibly could.

However, you are missing the entire point of my original post. I was wondering if it would be easier to get FAs in Seattle as opposed to Portland.
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You don't get it. If Allen tried to pull something like that they'd force him to sell. The NBA has specific rules in place to prevent owners from doing this. It CAN'T and WON'T happen.

The only draw Seattle has for free agents is that there is a bigger pool of players in the NBA that are from the Seattle area. Other than that I'm guessing most people who aren't from the Pacific Northwest think they are pretty much the same.
 
DET Gets: Clarkson, Aminu (BM TPE)
POR Gets: Kevin Love
CLE Gets: Leonard, Leuer, Swanigan, POR 2019 1st, DET 2019 1st, (more picks...?)

CLE saves ~$14.3M. Cleveland could then use their MLE on Len (who's young and fits their timeline), resign Hood, and still avoid the luxury tax while adding future picks and clearing a starting spot for Nance. Meyers would be a better fit with Nance than Thompson since he can space.
POR should sign a couple bigs afterwards... someone like Trevor Booker at PF and Jeff Witney at C.
DET Gets more depth, which they need.

The rotation s are what I think each team would go with.

PORTLAND:
Lillard (36) / McCollum (12) / WB IV / Simons
McCollum (23) / Curry (25) / Trent / Stauskas
Harkless (24) / Turner (24) / Layman
Love (34) / Collins (8) / Harkless (6) / Booker
Nurkic (30) / Collins (18) / Withey

DETROIT:
Jackson (32) / Clarkson (16)
Kennard (24) / Clarkson (12) / Bullock (12)
Robinson III (24) / Johnson (16) / Bullock (8)
Griffin (20) / Aminu (28)
Drummond (33) / Griffin (15)

CLEVELAND:
Sexton (28) / Hill (20)
Hood (33) / Smith (8) / Hill (7)
Osman (20) / Korver (18) / Smith (10)
Nance (28) / Swanigan (12) / Leuer (8)
Len (24) / Zizic (24) / Leonard / Thompson
 
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