Militia takes over Malheur National Wildlife Refuge headquarters

[MarAzul]

I did read Maris's post. I went to the link and read that "article". It stated the basic facts of the case and nothing more. As I have repeatedly stated, I'm believe there is more to the story. Just because the basic gist of a legal case is published on some private legal blog doesn't mean squat in the bigger picture. And go back and read your original red herring comment to my post. You took it completely out of context.....no surprise there. I used the contrast between the black and white experience purely as an example and you took that and ran with it. It gets old, man.

I'm not having the conversation with Maris. He didn't take my post out of context, and indeed, made no comment.

And while I have no doubt Maris knows what he is talking about as far as the BLM issues go, from what I got from actually reading his posts (you might want to try that. It was in a response to you) is that he was let go awhile back as a casualty of Affirmative Action policies by the Federal Government. So you got that wrong too.

Looks like you might be right! Something not right. I just watched this story on the news. What's this? The fire spread from their property to the federal land? They get jail time for this??
They served the time. Then the Feds appeal the sentence, so they get more time? A whole lot more time? ummm, this ain't right!

Not sure those Bundy dudes will help though.

 

[Denny Crane]

Looks like you might be right! Something not right. I just watched this story on the news. What's this? The fire spread from their property to the federal land? They get jail time for this??
They served the time. Then the Feds appeal the sentence, so they get more time? A whole lot more time? ummm, this ain't right!

Not sure those Bundy dudes will help though.

5th amendment

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

 

[julius]

Only lefties are allowed to protest.

Got it.

Barfo's america.

Hint: the people that are being protested aren't locals either. The militia wouldn't be there otherwise.

So if lefties protest, take over a building and threaten to stay there till the end of time, you're OK with it?

 

[MarAzul]

5th amendment

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

Yep, just what I was thinking. Serving the time then appeal say more???? Smells like bite two to me. Crap, will the Feds go for three? This ain't right!!

 

[barfo]

King of the strawman.

Always the kidder.

How about let the state of Oregon run the state of Oregon?

Pretty sure the state agrees with the Federal position here.

barfo

 

[Jesus Christ Son of God]

Jesus Christ....

Yes?

 

[Denny Crane]

So if lefties protest, take over a building and threaten to stay there till the end of time, you're OK with it?

When I was a young whippersnapper, they called those things "sit ins."

 

[Denny Crane]

Pretty sure the state agrees with the Federal position here.

barfo

Pretty sure the Federal position should be to mind its own business.

 

[barfo]

Only lefties are allowed to protest.

Got it.

Barfo's america.

Hint: the people that are being protested aren't locals either. The militia wouldn't be there otherwise.

Nobody said they shouldn't protest.

Speaking of straw men...

barfo

 

[barfo]

Pretty sure the Federal position should be to mind its own business.

It is minding it's own business. They are occupying Federal property.

barfo

 

[julius]

When I was a young whippersnapper, they called those things "sit ins."

sit ins kind of imply peaceful people, and not using guns or threatening behaviors.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

They're being called Y'all Qaeda and they're waging Yee Hawd!

Hahahahahaha!

Y'all Qaeda follows a strict interpretation of Shania law.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

 

[SlyPokerDog]

What You Need To Know About The Oregon Militia Standoff

During a rally in Oregon for two ranchers convicted of arson, a group of anti-government protesters initiated the armed occupation of a federal building at the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. Here is everything you need to know about the militia standoff:
Where is the standoff taking place?
The headquarters of Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, future capital of the Free Republic Of America.

How did this start?
Protests began after local ranchers Dwight and Steven Hammond were ordered to return to prison because their time already served for committing arson did not meet minimum-sentencing laws, which, to be fair, often do more harm than good and are certainly worthy of reevaluation.

Who are the ranchers protesting against?
Gub’ment.

Why did the ranchers take over the federal wildlife building?
You big-city folk wouldn’t understand.


How many people are involved in the standoff?
An estimated 150 militia members who would otherwise be armed and spouting anti-government rhetoric somewhere else.

What are the protesters’ demands?
$5 million in cash and safe passage to 1874.

Is there legitimacy to their complaints?
Compared to the plight of the Oregon’s nearly extinct short-tailed albatross? Absolutely not.

Who is Ammon Bundy?
An American patriot who is currently living inside a government wildlife building in the middle of Oregon to defend ranchers who burned down 130 acres of federal land.

Are the protesters violent?
They have vowed to only seek a peaceful overthrow of the entire U.S. federal government.

How long are they planning to stay?
As long as their supply of whiskey and bison chili lasts.

What is the militia ultimately hoping to achieve?
Garner enough attention over next few weeks to be brought onstage during rally for a low-polling GOP candidate.

Is the protest going to work?
Nope.

 

[Denny Crane]

Nobody said they shouldn't protest.

Speaking of straw men...

barfo

Actually you did complain and thumped your chest about the locals complaining.

Not strawman.

 

[Denny Crane]

It is minding it's own business. They are occupying Federal property.

barfo

It is public property. They pay taxes, they own it. If you want to occupy it, don't let the door hit you in the fanny on your way there.

 

[Denny Crane]

sit ins kind of imply peaceful people, and not using guns or threatening behaviors.

I was there at the time. The protesters threw rocks and baggies full of feces at the cops, among other things.

But those guys look like they have a club.

(1968 Chicago Democratic Convention)

 

[MarAzul]

Has anyone ever heard of the government appealing a conviction and sentence that has been served, to get a longer sentence?
Is this a first? Obama set a new first?

 

[Denny Crane]

Has anyone ever heard of the government appealing a conviction and sentence that has been served, l to get a longer sentence?
Is this a first? Obama set a new first?

In the case of mass murderers, the prosecution sometimes only charges against some of the murders so he has a few in reserve in case the trial doesn't go well.

But that's not charging the person with the same crime.

 

[barfo]

Actually you did complain and thumped your chest about the locals complaining.

Not strawman.

Did I complain about protesting? No, I did not.
Did I complain about an armed takeover of a public building? Perhaps so.
Did I 'thump my chest' about the locals? No, I did not. I did mention it though.

barfo

 

[MarAzul]

In the case of mass murderers, the prosecution sometimes only charges against some of the murders so he has a few in reserve in case the trial doesn't go well.

But that's not charging the person with the same crime.

I hope someone (other than those Bundy's) goes to bat for these guys, I think the Constitution has suffered another hit.

 

[Denny Crane]

Did I complain about protesting? No, I did not.
Did I complain about an armed takeover of a public building? Perhaps so.
Did I 'thump my chest' about the locals? No, I did not. I did mention it though.

barfo

You've complained throughout the thread.

 

[barfo]

It is public property. They pay taxes, they own it. If you want to occupy it, don't let the door hit you in the fanny on your way there.

That aint the way it works, except in your imagination.

barfo

 

[barfo]

You've complained throughout the thread.

So what if I have? Isn't that what you built this place for?

barfo

 

[Denny Crane]

That aint the way it works, except in your imagination.

barfo

You're complaining about someone far far away from you being on public land. They own it, they can be on it. You can go be on it, too.

Go for it.

Nothing stopping you.

Otherwise, you have no standing.

In law, standing or locus standing is the term for the ability of a party to demonstrate to the court sufficient connection to and harm from the law or action challenged to support that party's participation in the case.

 

[Denny Crane]

So what if I have? Isn't that what you built this place for?

barfo

It's fine, we put up with you.

 

[MarAzul]

So what if I have? Isn't that what you built this place for?

barfo

Ha! Not quite I am thinking. Ripping your ass after you post is more on target. Ha!

 

[barfo]

Has anyone ever heard of the government appealing a conviction and sentence that has been served, to get a longer sentence?
Is this a first? Obama set a new first?

The appeals court ruled that the lower court had failed to follow the law when it sentenced them. The supreme court refused to overturn the appeals court.

It doesn't have much of anything to do with Obama.

Also, it's totally not some unheard-of thing. Here's a basic outline of the process.

barfo

 

[MarAzul]

It doesn't have much of anything to do with Obama.

Oh, I think it does. This maybe a first. Never heard of an appeal of a conviction before. Some devious bugger wanted more. Hell, it is very rare to take a guy to court over
a fire getting out of control and expanding to government property. This sound fishy as hell. When I needed to burn on my ranch, I needed to get a fire permit, issued by the government.
Never heard of prosecuting a guy that had the permit and the necessary safety equipment on hand required to get the permit issued when the fire got out of control. They usually come to your aid. Something in not right here.

 

[barfo]

Oh, I think it does. This maybe a first. Never heard of an appeal of a conviction before. Some devious bugger wanted more. Hell, it is very rare to take a guy to court over
a fire getting out of control and expanding to government property. This sound fishy as hell. When I needed to burn on my ranch, I needed to get a fire permit, issued by the government.
Never heard of prosecuting a guy that had the permit and the necessary safety equipment on hand required to get the permit issued when the fire got out of control. They usually come to your aid. Something in not right here.

They set fires two different times. And one of their own relatives testified that it was arson.

barfo