Politics The Joe Biden Thread

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Rastapopoulos said:
Do you charge too much or is there a reason the Democrats haven't hired you as a consultant years ago given your deep understanding of the nation's psyche?
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Because if they were listening to me they wouldn't be making decisions based on how much money they can get out of corporations, or letting corporations write their policy.

Since the money the Democrats have comes from corporations those corporations wouldn't want them to hire somebody like me.
 
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barfo said:
You, sir, are more cynical than even these times call for. Not everyone in government is a bad actor 100% of the time.

Are there any laws, proposals, regulations, or other actions of government during the Biden administration that you don't believe were made in bad faith?

barfo
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The Democrats do business in bad faith. So do the Republicans. That's how our political system is set up.

Every state level or higher congressperson has to spend 3/4 of their time in an office making phonecalls to a party approved list of corporations and wealthy people to make promises and raise money in order to have the support of either party. If they do not do that, they will not be given support and the party will run somebody against them.

The difference is that Republicans are typically voting in their own best interest (or based on personal religious or other biases). Many Democrats and many of the people in the middle want to vote for somebody who put the greater good ahead of themselves. They want to vote on smart policy.

So when Democrats act like Republicans they lose the support of these people who aren't "Dems by default".
 
Phatguysrule said:
Because if they were listening to me they wouldn't be making decisions based on how much money they can get out of corporations, or letting corporations right there policy.

Since the money the Democrats have comes from corporations those corporations wouldn't want them to hire somebody like me.
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So you're saying (a) you know why Democrats don't win, and (b) Democrats don't care to know this because they're in the pocket of corporations. So you're saying the corporations don't want the Democrats to win?

So what outsider candidates are you giving your priceless information to?
 
Rastapopoulos said:
So you're saying (a) you know why Democrats don't win, and (b) Democrats don't care to know this because they're in the pocket of corporations. So you're saying the corporations don't want the Democrats to win?

So what outsider candidates are you giving your priceless information to?
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This isn't some new revelation. It's pretty well known.

Corporations don't care whether Republicans or Democrats win. They're both in the pockets of corporations.
 
Phatguysrule said:
The Democrats do business in bad faith. So do the Republicans. That's how our political system is set up.
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To some extent, this is true. But not nearly to the extent you claim.

Every state level or higher congressperson has to spend 3/4 of their time in an office making phonecalls to a party approved list of corporations and wealthy people to make promises and raise money in order to have the support of either party. If they do not do that, they will not be given support and the party will run somebody against them.
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I'd like to see the hard evidence for this. Certainly they spend some time fundraising. But 3/4?
As far as I can tell they spend 3/4ths of their time on vacation.

And when was the last time 'the party' ran someone against an incumbent as punishment for lack of fundraising? Has that ever actually happened?

But even if it was true, that hardly explains why you think the CFPB, which isn't elected, and whose members don't need to fundraise, is operating in bad faith.

barfo
 
barfo said:
You, sir, are more cynical than even these times call for. Not everyone in government is a bad actor 100% of the time.

Are there any laws, proposals, regulations, or other actions of government during the Biden administration that you don't believe were made in bad faith?

barfo
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As far as I'm concerned Biden has been a bad faith politician most of his career. The DNC is as well.

Off the top of my head I do appreciate the inflation reduction act for the decarbonization benefits and economic benefits. I appreciate the student loan forgiveness (even though I had to pay my own off).
 
barfo said:
To some extent, this is true. But not nearly to the extent you claim.



I'd like to see the hard evidence for this. Certainly they spend some time fundraising. But 3/4?
As far as I can tell they spend 3/4ths of their time on vacation.

And when was the last time 'the party' ran someone against an incumbent as punishment for lack of fundraising? Has that ever actually happened?

But even if it was true, that hardly explains why you think the CFPB, which isn't elected, and whose members don't need to fundraise, is operating in bad faith.

barfo
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There are a lot of first hand reports. It's obviously not something the parties like spreading around.

Norah O'Donnell: What has your party said about how members of Congress should raise money?

Rep. Rick Nolan: Well, both parties have told newly elected members of the Congress that they should spend 30 hours a week in the Republican and Democratic call centers across the street from the Congress, dialing for dollars.

Norah O'Donnell: Thirty hours a week?

Rep. Rick Nolan: Thirty hours is what they tell you you should spend. And it's discouraging good people from running for public office. I could give you names of people who've said, "You know, I'd like to go to Washington and help fix problems, but I don't want to go to Washington and become a mid-level telemarketer, dialing for dollars, for crying out loud."

Norah O'Donnell: You're saying members of Congress are becoming like telemarketers?


Rep. Rick Nolan: Well, 30 hours a week, that's a lot of telemarketing. Probably more than most telemarketers do.
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https://www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minutes-are-members-of-congress-becoming-telemarketers/
 
Phatguysrule said:
There are a lot of first hand reports. It's obviously not something the parties like spreading around.
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Yeah, politicians complain about fundraising. Big deal.
There's nothing there to support your view that the party somehow forces them to fundraise if they don't want to.
Obviously, there are a lot of reasons they will do so even though they don't enjoy it. And there are a lot of reasons the party would encourage them to do so.

I did notice one interesting thing in the link - it says the R boiler room has "About a dozen tiny offices, equipped with a phone and computer".
There are/were roughly 200 Republican congresspeople.
If all 200 spent 3/4ths of their time fundraising, wouldn't you need more than 12 phone rooms?

Money in politics is a big problem, we agree on that.
But I can't get on board with your view of the party as being this evil all-powerful entity that operates from an underground island lair.
It's not any more (or less) evil or powerful than the people who comprise it.
Same as your local school board, or any other grouping of humans.

barfo
 
barfo said:
Yeah, politicians complain about fundraising. Big deal.
There's nothing there to support your view that the party somehow forces them to fundraise if they don't want to.
Obviously, there are a lot of reasons they will do so even though they don't enjoy it. And there are a lot of reasons the party would encourage them to do so.

I did notice one interesting thing in the link - it says the R boiler room has "About a dozen tiny offices, equipped with a phone and computer".
There are/were roughly 200 Republican congresspeople.
If all 200 spent 3/4ths of their time fundraising, wouldn't you need more than 12 phone rooms?

Money in politics is a big problem, we agree on that.
But I can't get on board with your view of the party as being this evil all-powerful entity that operates from an underground island lair.
It's not any more (or less) evil or powerful than the people who comprise it.
Same as your local school board, or any other grouping of humans.

barfo
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It literally says they are told to spend 30hrs per week on the phones fundraising... From a pre-approved list.
 
Phatguysrule said:
It literally says they are told to spend 30hrs per week on the phones fundraising... From a pre-approved list.
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And I'll tell you that you should go down to the local 7-11 and buy a Slurpee.
And I'll advise you there's a sale right now on cherry flavor.

Now, have I forced you to buy a Slurpee?
And is it wrong of me to tell you how to save money?

If I had to dial for dollars, I'd certainly appreciate being given a list of people who had a decent likelihood of giving me money.

barfo
 
barfo said:
And I'll tell you that you should go down to the local 7-11 and buy a Slurpee.
And I'll advise you there's a sale right now on cherry flavor.

Now, have I forced you to buy a Slurpee?
And is it wrong of me to tell you how to save money?

If I had to dial for dollars, I'd certainly appreciate being given a list of people who had a decent likelihood of giving me money.

barfo
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I now understand why you support protections for employers to make sexual advances toward any and all of their employees.

Either that or we may be witnessing some serious cognitive dissonance...
 
Here's an alternate view of fund-raising reality.
Obviously this isn't 'the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth' either. But this part sounds right to me:

So how come you hear members of Congress complain about all the time they spend fundraising? "They exaggerate the amount of time they do it is they don’t like doing it," says Fitch. "I call this yard work syndrome. I don’t like doing my yard work so if you ask me how much of my weekend I spent on yard work I say the whole weekend. But it was really three hours."

It's also possible that there's huge variation in how much time members of Congress spend fundraising. That DCCC schedule might hold true for a new members from a contested district. But House incumbents typically have a 90 percent reelection rate. Most of them are in safe districts. A lot of the money they raise goes to the party rather than to them. They're not going to spend most of their day doing something they hate.
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barfo
 
Phatguysrule said:
I now understand why you support protections for employers to make sexual advances toward any and all of their employees.

Either that or we may be witnessing some serious cognitive dissonance...
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I have no idea what you are trying to say here.

barfo
 
barfo said:
Most definitely not. I'll support your right to do whatever you want with a Slurpee, but I'll thank you to do it in the privacy of your bedroom.

barfo
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Biden's greatest moral failure became his greatest political loss, Gaza. No one questioned Israel having the right to go after perpetrators of October 7 attack but instead they slaughtered a whole people. Over and over Biden said this or that is "red line"; over and over Israel crossed red line and nothing. More arms sent. Yes, he pursued cease fire but did nothing to stop genocide in the meantime. Blocked United Nations condemnation. Even feel good Democratic convention would not give five minute speaking slot to Palestinian speaker although several Palestinian American elected officials were available and ready to address the convention.

New study confirmed anecdotal evidence. 29% of 2020 Biden voters did not vote in 2024 presidential election and most listed Gaza as main reason. Trump pretends he got a landslide but it was a close election and those who did not vote decided it.

I am reminded of Lyndon Johnson. Like Biden he put through significant, even historic, domestic policies but they were overshadowed by massive escalation in Vietnam, causing large sections of population to abstain in 1968. His VP lost close election and landed us Nixon. Biden landed us someone far worse.
 
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