Politics The Joe Biden Thread

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barfo said:
I think that is a fantasy. Israel surely appreciates all the money and weapons we send them, but they wouldn't collapse if we stopped. They'd simply have to spend more of their own money on weapons. And they absolutely would do exactly that.

It would make us less complicit (still plenty complicit, since we've funded them all these years up till now) and we might feel better about that, but it wouldn't make Israel back off.

It might in fact make things worse, by making Israel feel more isolated.

We should do the experiment, though, because we shouldn't become any more complicit than we already are. I just don't think it will work to restrain Israel.

barfo
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I'm glad you think it's fantasy, but it doesn't seem to fantasy to former Israeli General, Itzhak Brik.

“All of our missiles, the ammunition, the precision-guided bombs, all the airplanes…it’s all from the US,” a retired Israeli general said in November. “The minute they turn off the tap, you can’t keep fighting.”
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https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/03/joe-biden-israel-gaza-war-netanyahu-rafah-palestinians/

The excuses are all so boring and tired as to why Joe Biden is so ineffective, and the polling reflects that.
 
Phatguysrule said:
Let us know when we have the ability to go back and change that, will you?
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This you?

Remove the desperation from the system and educate Palestinians on democracy. Plan on being there for at least 30 years to defend schools and hospitals and build up infrastructure.

Show them there is a better way. Win hearts and minds.
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We can't change that, but we can look at history and use better sense and caution to think you're in any position to pompously "educate Palestinians on democracy." What the hell does that even mean?

We don't even have democracy in the Democratic party.
 
AmirIcon said:
This you?



We can't change that, but we can look at history and use better sense and caution to think you're in any position to pompously "educate Palestinians on democracy." What the hell does that even mean?

We don't even have democracy in the Democratic party.
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Because Gaza is basically the same right now as Iran was before the US coup, right?

Lol. Get real.

We're a hell of a lot closer to a peaceful (within our borders) representative democracy than Gaza. And we could help immensely.

What it means is that they voted for Hamas and let Hamas become more powerful than the population. So the population couldn't get rid of them when they wanted to.

Now Hamas has brought a world of hurt down upon the people. The people are generally very young and uneducated.

With safe schools and hospitals their lives would improve tremendously as would their ability to prevent the next Hamas taking over their country.
 
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Phatguysrule said:
Because Gaza is basically the same right now as Iran was before the US coup, right?

Lol. Get real.

We're a hell of a lot closer to a peaceful (within our borders) representative democracy than Gaza. And we could help immensely.
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That's because there isn't a nuclear power giving all their power and might to our enemy.

You know how you help? Get Israel's boot off their necks and stop excusing barbaric crimes committed by Israel - that includes the kidnappings, the rapes, poisoning of water, blockade of food ingredients, and much more. Allow them their sovereignty to have their own airport and military. If you start there, Palestine will thrive.
 
AmirIcon said:
You know how you help? Get Israel's boot off their necks and stop excusing barbaric crimes committed by Israel - that includes the kidnappings, the rapes, poisoning of water, blockade of food ingredients, and much more. Allow them their sovereignty to have their own airport and military. If you start there, Palestine will thrive.
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I haven't excused any of that. And no, that wouldn't be enough. Otherwise they would have gotten rid of Hamas before Hamas pissed off Israel.

Been there, tried that. They need more help than that.
 
AmirIcon said:
"educate Palestinians on democracy." What the hell does that even mean?
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It means I'm proposing we educate the people who choose to come to the schools (which I've proposed we provide and defend) in a manner which will help them to establish and maintain a strong and lasting democracy.
 
Phatguysrule said:
I haven't excused any of that. And no, that wouldn't be enough. Otherwise they would have gotten rid of Hamas before Hamas pissed off Israel.

Been there, tried that. They need more help than that.
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What? I don't know if you know this, but all the horrible things I listed was happening long before Oct. 7th and the corrupt Palestinian authority wasn't doing anything about it -- that's why they elected Hamas, to do something about it.

Conversely, if Americans weren't struggling so much, they would have never turned to Donald Trump. Hamas is merely a symptom of the problem, not the problem itself.
 
Phatguysrule said:
It means I'm proposing we educate the people who choose to come to the schools (which I've proposed we provide and defend) in a manner which will help them to establish and maintain a strong and lasting democracy.
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Difficult to do when we're arming the ones bombing their universities, no? Their education is fine. They need freedom and opportunity to prosper. It starts with ending the occupation.
 
AmirIcon said:
Difficult to do when we're arming the ones bombing their universities, no? Their education is fine. They need freedom and opportunity to prosper. It starts with ending the occupation.
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They wouldn't be bombing universities that were staffed and guarded by Americans. Which is what I'm proposing.
 
AmirIcon said:
What? I don't know if you know this, but all the horrible things I listed was happening long before Oct. 7th and the corrupt Palestinian authority wasn't doing anything about it -- that's why they elected Hamas, to do something about it.

Conversely, if Americans weren't struggling so much, they would have never turned to Donald Trump. Hamas is merely a symptom of the problem, not the problem itself.
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We need to better educate Americans as well. Nobody has said otherwise.
 
AmirIcon said:
What? I don't know if you know this, but all the horrible things I listed was happening long before Oct. 7th and the corrupt Palestinian authority wasn't doing anything about it -- that's why they elected Hamas, to do something about it.

Conversely, if Americans weren't struggling so much, they would have never turned to Donald Trump. Hamas is merely a symptom of the problem, not the problem itself.
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Also, I didn't say it started on October 7th, but it certainly ratcheted up.

And Israel should have probably been doing as I proposed sooner as well, IMO. The US should have been doing so in Afghanistan and Iraq.

That is what the policy should be, IMO. That should be the main goal of all government.

Educate and strengthen the population so they are capable of replacing corrupt leaders and governments before they get too powerful.
 
'Betrayal of Labor': Biden Nominates Ex-Trump Official to Amtrak Board

"This appointment reads less like an oversight and more like a slap in the face to those who championed worker safety and stronger regulations," said Railroad Workers United.

https://www.commondreams.org/news/biden-amtrak-board

Rail workers voiced outrage Thursday after U.S. President Joe Biden quietly nominated a former Trump administration official with a history of supporting deregulation to Amtrak's board of directors, a move that one alliance of unions called a "slap in the face."

Ronald Batory, who has ties to the rail industry, served as head of the Federal Railroad Administration (FRA) under former President Donald Trump, who aggressively slashed transport and rail safety regulations during his four years in office—laying the groundwork for disasters such as the East Palestine, Ohio crash.
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If Biden's defense of democracy is to hire Ex-Trump officials. It looks to me, like democracy is already in trouble.
 
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As usual, Road Ratt doesn't understand the First Amendment. Free speech is not exempt from criticism.
 
Road Ratt said:
Biden to condemn antisemitism, praise free speech at Holocaust remembrance

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...n&cvid=408e10127bb841e58ee739806e29a0ff&ei=85

Biden to praise "free speech" while condemning... your right to free speech. :doh:
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You are aware that condemning someones speech is not the same as violating someones 1st amendment right, right?

I mean, the two are literally not the same thing.

You have the right to say what you want, the *GOVERNMENT* can't take that away. Your speech can be condemned and your speech can cause you to lose your job/ livelihood, and you can suffer consequences from it...but the government can't stop you from saying it.

You can suffer consequences from your words.
 
Phatguysrule said:
Nothing like discriminating against people based on their race and disabilities... Just like the good old days...
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Even more so, nothing like discriminating against people based on disabilities while *ignoring* your own guys significantly worse speaking ability.
 
julius said:
Even more so, nothing like discriminating against people based on disabilities while *ignoring* your own guys significantly worse speaking ability.
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This is just cognitive dissonance. Obviously you don’t like Trump for many reasons, which is fine, but to just blurt out something so patently false shows willful ignorance. Biden could be the best guy in the world and Trump the worst, it wouldn’t change the fact that Biden is senile and can barely slur his way through basic sentences, and Trump simply does not have that problem, no matter how bad he may be.

Why is the most basic honesty so hard for people? If Trump claimed the sky is blue you would twist yourselves into pretzels and wreath with disgust trying to disprove it.

Just take the L on the senility topic and move on to legitimate criticisms of Trump, of which there are plenty.
 
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jonnyboy said:
This is just cognitive dissonance. Obviously you don’t like Trump for many reasons, which is fine, but to just blurt out something so patently false shows willful ignorance. Biden could be the best guy in the world and Trump the worst, it wouldn’t change the fact that Biden is senile and can barely slur his way through basic sentences, and Trump simply does not have that problem, no matter how bad he may be.

Why is the most basic honesty so hard for people? If Trump claimed the sky is blue you would twist yourselves into pretzels and wreath with disgust trying to disprove it.

Just take the L on the senility topic and move on to legitimate criticisms of Trump, of which there are plenty.
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Please leave the cult.
 
jonnyboy said:
This is just cognitive dissonance. Obviously you don’t like Trump for many reasons, which is fine, but to just blurt out something so patently false shows willful ignorance. Biden could be the best guy in the world and Trump the worst, it wouldn’t change the fact that Biden is senile and can barely slur his way through basic sentences, and Trump simply does not have that problem, no matter how bad he may be.

Why is the most basic honesty so hard for people? If Trump claimed the sky is blue you would twist yourselves into pretzels and wreath with disgust trying to disprove it.

Just take the L on the senility topic and move on to legitimate criticisms of Trump, of which there are plenty.
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I voted for Joe last time but am thinking of not voting for either this time. I do agree that Joes in no shape to really be a strong President and hope that during the dem convention someone else will rise to a vote? Trump would lose to any dem.
 
No other Democrat is going to jump up at the convention after all the primaries and get nominated. You can vote for one old guy who supports democracy and civil rights and has wrong positions on some issues or you can vote for an old guy who wants to be a dictator, abolish independent judiciary, end civil service and overturn civil rights gains.
 
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